bj Says:
Sunday, November 16, 2008 @9:12:24 AM

LOL! Oh geez, this is SO MUCH LIKE my first jam experience! I gotta tell you though, mine was an oldtime jam. It didn't help! Even worse, I can watch the guitar player and know which chords he or she is playing! I have experience that you didn't have and my first jam with my instrument with me was just as bad as yours. So don't despair, this is NORMAL.

I think you're intellectualizing this WAY too much. This is what I suggest. Turn on the radio. Now, BY EAR ONLY-- try to find three notes you can play to ANY song that comes on. Even the stupid stinking commercial jingles (maybe especially those since they're so mindlessly simple!) Do this for 15 to 20 minutes a day. After awhile you'll find you're playing more than three notes and are able to play a simple accompaniment to any song you hear. Even if it's one long note that you play for each chord change . . .

I went to my first bluegrass jam not that long ago. Jane said I did just fine. It's because I have been working to play a bit along to anything I hear (even hard rock!) that I could do this. And believe me, I didn't play fast, I didn't play fancy. I kept it very very very simple. The idea is to blend in . . . at least until you find your chops.

FiddleCat Says:
Sunday, November 16, 2008 @9:15:57 AM

Awww...I feel for ya. What I did was learn what the cords looks like on a guitar, that way you know what cord they are playing when they switch. If you learn it in mandolin I found it eaiser because it so close to fiddle being strung the same. I also purchased a DVD called Bluegrass Slow Jam for the Total Beginner. It teaches you about this cord stuff and what to look for. Teaches chopping. and basic rules and all kinds of stuff. I found it real helpful. They play songs and you play along at home.

SMDTMTL Says:
Sunday, November 16, 2008 @10:40:56 AM

It just sounds to me like this isn't the group for you to be trying to play along with at this time. Don't let this discourage you. Find some people, or even just one person, who's interested in the same tunes you're interested in, and is at a compatible level.. It takes a while to get anywhere with this instrument. "Adversity is your friend"... I've heard said.... The fiddle is a difficult instrument.
Do you have any software for slowing tunes down? "Audacity" software is a free download and will slow things down to where you can learn them a note at a time if you want. That helps a lot. Learning an instrument builds over time.

Keep trying and don't let anyone discourage you.
Steve

fiddlepogo Says:
Sunday, November 16, 2008 @11:24:38 AM

Bryan,

I know it seems overwhelming, but
It's okay, you just have to break the stuff down
into digestible bites.

Knowing a little guitar could be a big help.
Old Time backup guitar is just "Cowboy chords"
on the first three frets, so it's not that hard to learn,
and being able to play backup guitar can be a ticket to getting
to play in jams and bands with fiddlers that you really want to learn from.
If you don't want to learn guitar, though, you could take photos
of a guitarist friend's left hand playing B7, E, A, D, G, C, F, Em, Am, and Bm.
Write the correct chord name on the back of the photo, and use them like flash cards, and drill yourself until you get them all correct.

Hey, you found the notes to back-up the G chord on the fiddle-
that's a good start! If you take those two notes you played for a G chord,
and put your first finger on the "2nd fret" of the G string, and play the D along with it, you have what goes along with a D chord.
If you press it down on the same place on the D string instead,
and play the G string along with it, you have something that will go along with a C chord. If you press BOTH strings down with your index in the same
place, you have an A chord. Those four chords will get you through most
Bluegrass, Country, and Old Time songs in the key of G (unless they throw in an E minor chord) and the D, G, and A will get you through almost as many D tunes. Work on those for now.

Keep on going to the jams. Listen. Watch.
If you keep coming back with an instrument, kindhearted souls may show you stuff- and it's stuff that will stick with you because you get to see it being used in a practical way in a jam.
Look and see if there are any other newbies like you.
They may be feeling just as bewildered as you are. Start a beginners slow jam with them,
share the tunes you learn with each other, and slowly your little jam will speed up, and
get more tunes, and someday, you'll be sounding just as good as the bluegrass jam you went to is now... but when that happens, remember what it was like to be a newbie at a jam, and be kind to them!

Keep going to the hard jam.
Get a good mini-recorder.
Get Amazing Slow-Downer software
and slow the songs down so you can learn them easier-
and listen, listen, listen!

There's a lot to learn, but if you learn something new every day about the fiddle
and the kind(s) of fiddle music you favor, in a couple of years, you will
know an amazing amount of stuff. Just don't get discouraged and give up!

JohnS Says:
Sunday, November 16, 2008 @12:30:29 PM

Well, I was glad to see you at the jam last night despite your discomfort. The first time I went to that jam was 1 week after I got my fiddle. So, I fully understand your feelings. I just lurked in the background for a few sessions trying to make some sense out of what I was doing there. But, the first time I was able to find two or three notes in a row that fit the tune I was hooked.

I dont know if this is typical, but this jam group generally plays bluegrass, but will play anything from country music to square dance tunes to old-time traditional, to Celtic traditional and anything in between. They even attempted a few Cajun tunes once. A lot of the long-time players in the group will bring out their favorites every session, so everyone gets to know them pretty well. But I would say that usually a third of the songs no one really knows, and in a lot of cases most of the players have never heard them before. The point is that most everyone is winging it on most songs.

For a guitar player, winging it means following the standard chord progressions for the key. For a fiddle player it means that you are FREE to improvise, and noodle around with either the melody or a harmony. I emphasized the word free because it is liberating to realize that no one in that group really cares if youre playing the right notes. Just play softly until you think what youre doing adds something to the sound, and then go for it. I only got to that point once myself, and it wasnt great, but I sure had a blast doing it. It is such an adrenalin rush. This group doesnt have any expectations for you to take a break like a lot of bluegrass jams do. But if you have something you want to jump in with just wait for an opportunity, and grab the lead.

As I was learning new tunes from dots, and also going to these jam sessions I still had to come to grips with the fact that until I was good enough to lead a tune all of the tunes I could "somewhat" play from sheet music didn't matter in this jam. I enjoy playing with one group I found that plays from dots. We have a music book we play from, and the music we play ends up sounding a lot more polished. Its just a very different atmosphere than the Lafayette jam. I have come to look at the playing from notes side of things as the way to become technically proficient at making music come out of the fiddle. I practice just what is written, as it is written. I play it over and over again. I find the best bowing, tempo, and timing that work for me. And, I play it over and over again. There is value in that, for me.

The reason I say that learning a song from notes doesnt matter in this type of jam is that unless youre leading a tune, you have to know how to adapt to what the others are playing. Last night they played Soldiers Joy, Red Haired Boy, St Anns Reel, and a couple of others that I can play pretty well. But the versions they play is different enough from the versions I know that it might as well be different tunes. In fact, last night I lead one tune Redwing, but the guy next to me started playing a little bit different ornamentation than I was used to, and it threw off my timing, and the thing went down the tubes fast. It took me a few bars to regain my footing again. Then I was fine. This morning I look back at this and I get that rush all over again because I LEAD A SONG, and I wasnt perfect but I DIDNT SUCK (too awful bad). To an outsider, this jam session can, at times, be best described as cacophony. These are not professional musicians but they all bring something different to the group. These differences sometimes dont make for tight musicianship. But people leave these sessions with a smile on their face, whistling a favorite tune they got a chance to play.

I agree completely with BJs comment. In a jam situation like this its all about your musical ear. I brought a digital recorder to several sessions. And I have a blast just turning up the volume on my computer and playing along with the jam session over and over again. Each time I do, I hear the melody in my head a little bit better and I hear the harmony in my head a little bit better. Now at a jam its starting to become automatic. When I hear a note, I feel that its an A (Im not always right, but Im getting better). Or I think - an arpeggio would work here. Or, I think this sound just like some other tune Ive heard.

I dont remember who said it in one of the threads about reading music vs learning by ear, but I agree you are using different parts of the brain when you play from notes as opposed to playing from ear like you would improvising in a bluegrass jam. Just coming to that realization help me out a lot because now I know what to work on to be successful at each.

I dont know yet if this is true, but I believe that even though these two processes of making music are so different they surly have to contribute to each other. For me, successful improvisation comes, at least partially, from an understanding of music theory. Now Im no expert in music theory, but for example I can see how an arpeggio naturally fits in to a tune. And I know even before I try it that it will work. At the same time, dots dont tell the whole story. At least for me, I need to take a step back from the sheet music and feel the music to get the sound right.

Last night, there was a classically trained violinist in the group that was there for moral support for her sister who is just picking up bluegrass guitar. She said this was the first time she had ever played with a group without having music in front of her. She was obviously technically very good, and just as obviously she was uncomfortable. I know Im rambling on. But, I hate to see you discouraged because of what might be unrealistic expectations. Your experience with your teacher learning to read music and play is good. But, this doesnt prepare you for a diverse jam like you went to last night. Again, Im no expert. You have been playing longer than I have. But, for what its worth I just wanted to let you know I went through the same thing, and that in the end you will enjoy and benefit from your experiences at the jam session. Don't give up.

JohnS Says:
Sunday, November 16, 2008 @2:35:20 PM

I re-read what I wrote, and thought I might have left you with the idea that we never play the same song twice. I think the idea of a jam like this is that it is a place to learn new tunes as well as improvise. In fact I've been trying to learn a new song from each session. Over the last four sessions I've picked up Little Cabin Home On The Hill, Natchez Under The Hill, Rosin The Bow, and from last night's jam I want to learn Grandma's Feather Bed. I'm not ready to debut any of these tunes yet. But we play them frequently enough in the jam that I'm trying to learn to play them up-to-speed.

Rene Says:
Sunday, November 16, 2008 @5:07:31 PM

Sounds like my night a week ago. Hang in there. Believe me I know how you feel. We just got back from out trip with our girls, and m playing was terrible again. I seem to do well when I'm alone.

FiddleJammer Says:
Sunday, November 16, 2008 @7:03:35 PM

If you know some old time tunes, find an old time jam or festival. Or, start a small group yourself. (Easier than you might think.) Bluegrass is a different animal. That said, if you like bluegrass, you've not wasted anytime by working on an old time foundation. Any time spent learning something about the fiddle, regardless of style, is time well spent.

Get back on the horse.

FiddleJammer Says:
Sunday, November 16, 2008 @7:08:38 PM

http://www.folkjam.org/local/map?geostart=39.853/-86.304&radius=90

There's some acoustic jams that might be a little more at your speed. Good luck.

Thibodeaux Says:
Tuesday, November 18, 2008 @6:41:12 AM

Don't worry, Bryan, we're all definitely with ya. The one time I "jammed" with some fellow musicians, I just did the "one long note that you play for each chord change" that BJ suggested above, and that was about the best I could do without falling apart. On Halloween night one of my fellow theatre producers hosted a "vaudeville" show and insisted I play a couple of simple songs -- couldn't get halfway through even one of 'em, even though I've been playing most of them for a year now. Something about the public format, combined with my own lack of experience ... I just collapse every time. I think that those of us on this level just have to keep throwing ourselves out there until we can start to pick little things up bit by bit, and hold ourselves together in the fray! Hang in there. :)

fiddlesis Says:
Thursday, November 20, 2008 @9:03:55 AM

I know exactly what you are talking about. I bought two books which have helped me immeasureably...they are called ESSENTIAL ELEMENTS VIOLIN BOOK I AND II, WITH CD'S. Going through these two books has taught me alot and given me confidence. The cd's allow you to play along with an orchestra. Although orchestra music is not my first choice of music, I have enjoyed it to the fullest and it is an adrenalin rush to actually play along. Good luck!