hendrid - Posted - 09/29/2009:  09:06:48

Was going through the Learning Songs thread this morning and Fly Around was mentioned. Hmm I don't have that one scoped out. What a bag of worms. Turns out Fly Around My Pretty Little Miss has relationships with Susannah Gal or Susanna Girl and Blue Eyed Girl. I have heard them all in the past.

Susanna Gal has a different high part closer to Sally Ann in one version says ibiblio.com. There are some entries for these tunes in our media archive. Printed out the ibiblio.com conversion from ABC to sheet music. Wonder what the core melody is. By ear I guess.

Thinking about starting a thread on Core Beginner Songs Recommended to as bj, Brad, and Jehanna and others mention for the tricks. What core set of beginner songs have most of the tricks or flow you need.

Some of the Fly Around My Pretty Little Miss lyrics:
Fly around my pretty little miss,
Fly around my daisy;
Fly around my pretty little miss,
You like to drive me crazy.
***
The variant “Blue-eyed Gal” has similar lyrics, which go:
Chorus:
Fly around, my blue-eyed gal
Fly around my daisy;
Fly around my blue-eyed gal
Dam' near drive me crazy. *

Susannah Gal:
16 horses in my team
The leader he is blind
I'm going down that rocky road
To see that gal of mine.
***
How'd you make you living now
Susan-anna gal
Drinking whiskey and playing cards
Susan-anna gal


Don

OTJunky - Posted - 09/29/2009:  10:05:30

It's even worse than you think - another alternate title is "Western Country".

I think Rayna Gellert recorded it under the title "Fly Around My Pretty Little Miss" in the key of G while Tommy Jarrell recorded in the key of D under another title - can't remember whether it was "Susanna Gal" or "Western Country" though I remember that the line "Goin' to that Western Country" is in the lyrics he sang. But I think "Susanna Gal" also included in his lyrics.

When played in G the B-part's noticeably different than what Tommy Jarrell plays in D.

I think Rayna Gellert's version could reasonably called a "beginner" tune though there're some "tricks" in Jarrell's version that can present some challenges even to an experienced non-appalachian fiddler.

Generally, with respect to lyrics that go along with old time fiddle tunes - I think that people often just sang what came to mind with individual fiddlers settling over time on the lyrics they liked. So, the fact that one set of lyrics got captured on a recording doesn't necessarily indicate there's anything "canonical" about them.

Certainly my experiences in jams has been that you can sing pretty much anything you want to. People are just happy to hear singing to break up the never-ending purely instrumental sound...

--OTJ
"I can barely fiddle on four strings. Why would I want five?"

robinja - Posted - 09/29/2009:  10:52:20

OTJ - I don't have Rayna's recording, but I suspect that her version in G is based on Frank Blevins and His Tarheel Rattlers, which you can hear here:

juneberry78s.com/otmsampler/32...0Miss.mp3

(Hope the link works - if not, just go to juneberry78s.com, and go to their Roots Music Listening Room, then go to the Juneberry 78's Old Time Music Sampler and find the tune.)

I actually think it's harder to play a passable version of the tune in G than the tune in D, mainly because of the work on the low string and the necessary C double-stop. I would definitely put the version in D on a "Core Beginner Tunes" list - I think it's pretty straightforward, fun, and commonly known. You don't have to play it like Tommy right out of the chute (or ever, for that matter!)

Judy

hendrid - Posted - 09/29/2009:  11:51:07

You're sure right OTJ. Thanks. ibiblio.com below

WESTERN COUNTRY. AKA and see “Blue Eyed Girl/Gal,” “Fare Thee Well My Pretty Little Miss,” "Fly Around My Pretty Little Miss," “Susannah/Suzanna Gal [1].” Old#8209;Time, Breakdown. USA; West Virginia, Virginia, North Carolina, Kentucky. D Major. Standard tuning. AABB. A variant of the song perhaps better known to old-time musicians as “Fly Around My Pretty Little Miss” or “Fly Around My Pretty Little Pink.” The 78 RPM era group The Hillbillies, a 1920’s stringband from around Galax, Virginia, recorded the tune in 1926 under the title “Blue-Eyed Girl.” Lyrics go:
***
I'm going to the Western Country
Leavin you behind
I'm going to the Western Country
Leavin you behind
***
I wish I was in the Western Country
Settin in a big armchair
One arm around my whiskey jug
The other round my dear
***
Banjo player Dent Wimmer of Floyd, Floyd County, Virginia, sang:
***
When I was in the western country,
Where the weather was so dry;
The sun came out and froze me,
Suzannah don’t you cry.
***
Wimmer’s playing partner, fiddler Sam Connor, called the tune “Little Pigee” from the verse:
***
Run the old hog over the fence,
And the little pigs through the cracks.
***
This verse was used by The Hillbillies in the 1925 recording of “Whoa Mule” for Okeh Records. See note for “Pretty Little Pink.” Source for notated version: Kyle Creed (North Carolina) [Brody]. Brody (Fiddler’s Fakebook), 1983. Songer (Portland Collection), 1997; pg. 208. Appleseed APR CD 1036, Frank Proffitt. Biograph 6003, "The Original Bogtrotters." Mountain, Kyle Creed#8209; "Blue Ridge Style Square Dance Time." County 713, Cockerham, Jarrell, and Jenkins#8209; "Down to the Cider Mill" (appears as "Suzanna Gal"). County 201, The Old Virginia Fiddlers#8209; "Rare Recordings" (appears as "Susanna Gal"). Document DOCD-8039, The Hillbillies (reissue). Folkways FA 2375, "Old Reliable String Band" (appears as "Fly Around"). Folkways FA 2398, New Lost City Ramblers#8209; "vol. 3" (appears as "Fly Around"). Library of Congress (2741-A-1), 1939, J.W. "Peg" Thatcher (& the Bogtrotters). Musical Traditions MTCD 321-2, Sam Connor & Dent Wimmer (et al) – “Far in the Mountains, vols. 1 & 2” (2002). Rounder CD 1702, Hobart Smith. Smithsonian Folkways SFCD 40077, Lee Sexton – “Mountain Music of Kentucky.” Vocalation 5017 (78 RPM), The Hillbillies (1926). Yazoo CD 2028, Frank Blevins & his Pilot Mountaineers (reissue).
X:1
T:Western Country
R:Reel
M:4/4
L:1/8
N:from Dirk Powell, Rounder CD 0444, transcribed by Bruce Thomson
K:D
|:fafe dABc|dBAG F4|A2A2 BABd|f3f f4|fafe dABc|
dBAG F4|A2AA BABc|d3d d4::fgag f2a2|b3a bafg|
abag fga2|e3e e2fg|abag fga2|b3a bafg|abag fgfe|d3d d4:|



Don

alaskafiddler - Posted - 09/29/2009:  20:27:23

Rayna's version is based on Frank Blevins version.
One other noticeable difference in the G version is that it has a definite punctuation when it goes to the 4 chord, the C chord, the second beat. In the D version it usually just stays on the one chord of D in that spot. You don't have to play a C doublestop, The melodic line is just an E note. You could play that plain, or add an open G string. Some beginners find this version actually easier. Tommy's version has some more complicated bowing. You are right the G version is very different, it starts with the V chord, or D. In some ways the B part is harder, although it kind of just rides on one or two notes, getting them to sound not hokey is tough. Sometimes the simpler the melody the harder it is. There is nothing there but bowing.

Another great version is Emmet Lundy's version, though I'm not sure how available it is. Rafe Stefanini recorded a version based on it. It has a whole other quality to it.

As far as the words, I notice many words are interchangeable with other songs. As far as the "core" melody? Mostly I think it is in the sung melody. The Tommy, Emmet and Frank versions mentioned all share a core melody for the A part, just too similar to be considered otherwise. And you can sing the same vocal line to them all. To me in some styles "core" is more about contour, and perhaps phrasing. Some D versions the lowest the vocal goes down is to an F#, others only down to an A note, yet they sound quite similar.

But it does pose a curious question. If you think of core by eliminating extraneous notes, how does one draw the line where to stop? If you think substitution of notes, how many? When does it just become a different tune?


George

fiddledan - Posted - 09/30/2009:  07:08:29

You might find this discussion from BHO interesting

banjohangout.org/forum/archive...ID=130953

Play nice!
Dan Levenson
Now Available "Old Time Festival Tunes for Fiddle and Mandolin"
OldTimeMusic.us
Now teaching regularly at San Diego's Old Time Music

hendrid - Posted - 09/30/2009:  07:35:12

Thanks Dan, appreciate it, could not bring up the link until I brought up a second explorer menu and signed into BHO. Then back to my FHO menu and the link came right up.

Nice tune and I am going to be forced to work on it some.

Edit and add some input from Dan's BHO stuff.

similar or same tune
Blue Eyed Gal
Susannah Gal and variations
Western Country
Waxies' Dargle, Irish Tune
Sugar Betty Ann

Don

Edited by - hendrid on 09/30/2009 07:58:26

DougD - Posted - 09/30/2009:  08:42:43

Around here that tune is called "Pretty Little Pink," and I think Fred Price played it in G.

I believe this song is somehow derived, by some obscure path, from "Oh! Susanna," the Stephen Foster song that was one of the big hits of the 19th century. You can hear some similarities in the tune, and in the words Dent Wimmer sang.

I've just uploaded a recent version to my homepage here: fiddlehangout.com/myhangout/me...icid=5236

Edited by - DougD on 09/30/2009 08:45:00

fiddlecraver - Posted - 10/01/2009:  14:32:43

In Western Maryland it was known as Pretty Little Pink... and is a song with refernce to the Mexican War... ill have to record it if i get a chance

-Shawn

manmademusic - Posted - 10/01/2009:  18:19:02

Where is this "core beginners list"? Is this something tangible or is it a myth? Seeing as I am a rank beginner myself it sure would be nice to see that list.

Gary

hendrid - Posted - 10/02/2009:  06:51:37

Hi Gary, you might post your reply on the Core Beginners Songs thread which is now down the list a little.

The thought relates to maybe simpler tunes that might get your fingers used to the many one to 4 bars or so fingering that are pretty common and recur a lot. There may be no such thing as a good list. Maybe just something that comes with more and more tunes under your belt.

Don