Rene - Posted - 04/14/2011:  19:30:46

So the husband has often carefully observed that my double stops tend to sound sharp and harsh.  I have put a tuner on and made sure I was correct, even tried a couple of different tuners.  Tonight to spare him some agony (even though he seldom complains and is very encouraging) I clipped a clothes pin on the bridge and he asked me what happened "your double stops sound better than they ever have, such a mellow sweet tone"  So, what's the problem here?  Is it something in the set-up or just ole Roscoe (the fiddle).  I also noticed one other time when I played with the clothes pin (most of my clothes pins stay busy on the clothes line) that I seem to have a keener sense of hearing the notes. Thoughts, suggestions........

ChickenMan - Posted - 04/14/2011:  19:50:47

Muting covers up some of the overtones and might change the way you hear the pitch (slightly).  Mellows the sound.  I like to use a rolled up dollar bill.  

fiddlehangout.com/topic/8061/#122687

scroll down about 2/3 of the way and look for post by oldtimer with photo.  It sounds so much sweet and slightly quieter.

jamieholmes - Posted - 04/14/2011:  23:52:30

I actually always use some sort of mute weather it's a wire or a bill to sweeten the  tone a little bit. Not that it mutes that much.

mudbug - Posted - 04/15/2011:  02:06:43

I practice with a mute on and take it off to play with others.  I can get a couple different sounds with the mute on.  If it's close to the strings,  the sound is very muted,  but if I have it raised up  some,  the tone is nice and it lets me hear distinctly without a big sound in my ear.  Mistakes in intonation are a lot less jarring,  so I'm not tensed up about making mistakes.

Mandogryl - Posted - 04/15/2011:  04:53:46

When I play music with my partner, I use a mute so I can hear her violin.

Otherwise I never use one, though I do wear an ear plug in my left ear.

eric marten - Posted - 04/15/2011:  08:46:47

I think an unintended side benefit of using a heavy duty mute is, that while you're using it, your tone is so reduced that you instinctively work harder at bowing strongly, and then when you remove it,  some of that extra work pays off with a fuller tone.

dogwalkin - Posted - 04/15/2011:  09:15:47

Lots and lots of old fiddlers used the little wire mute. Mostly because it would sweeten up some of those fiddles they had to play. Most of the old timers did not get to choose from an array of fiddles. They ordered one out of a catolog and played it. Probably never even had a true "set up". 

edkarch - Posted - 04/15/2011:  11:27:58

I know several Bluegrass Bass players use a wire mute (big bass sized) over the bridge all the time to kill the overtones and get a purer sound.

Rene - Posted - 04/15/2011:  13:46:09

I'm probably going to switch back and forth.  If it were only me hearing the more mellow tone I would attribute it to my ears close proximity to the fiddle, but since the husband noticed a big difference then I know it changed things.  I really would like to change the setup to achieve this tone without a mute.

I liked the dollar weaved through..you  have a mute and you are never totally broke.

transplant - Posted - 04/15/2011:  14:34:12

By cutting the higher overtones, the mute makes the audible grind of slight finger mistuning less obvious. I can get more mathematical if you like, or you may work it out yourself by thinking about overtone beat frequencies...

Switching back and forth seems like a sensible plan.

Rene - Posted - 04/16/2011:  05:23:44

Thanks transplant for skipping the  more mathematical approach :)  , would have gave me one more thing to stew over.

transplant - Posted - 04/16/2011:  06:44:26

 I had a funny feeling this was not the place for it. Suffice it to say that there are reasons double stops seem easier and sound nicer with a little muting. You are not just hearing things. Well, actually, you are hearing things, but... I think I'd better stop now. ;)

Rene - Posted - 04/16/2011:  07:37:25

Ah transplant..you've hit on another topic......reduced hearing and ringing in the hears and how it affects what I am hearing.  It's going from bad to worse.   :)  I do still have a good sense of humor intact which should be mandatory for anyone trying to play fiddle.

transplant - Posted - 04/16/2011:  08:13:44

I take comfort in the fiddle being so close to my ear that I can't help but hear it. The ringing comes and goes for me, and thank goodness it doesn't seem to get too much in the way of anything so far.

I think I'll spend some time today with an earplug on the left side. At first that old trick seems like it makes things more difficult, but after a while I think it gives me a better sense of the sound out in the room.

Ozarkian D.L. - Posted - 04/16/2011:  08:57:28

Ahhh yes....Tinnitus....a medical malady I've been plagued with most'a my life ( from 33 yrs. railroad work I'm sure ).

emedicinehealth.com/tinnitus/a...le_em.htm   I've discoverred it is aggraviated by certain medications ( esp.

asprin ).

Have you tried alligator clips on on your fiddle bridge ? If not get'cha a couple of em at Radio Shack ( tha ones with tha

rubber covered handles ). Try em placed on different places of tha bridge ( both bass & treble side ) & you'll notice tha mellower tone fronmyerfiddle  .

I use em all'a time. Their a cheep investment. Just my 2 cent opinion.   

hickoryknot - Posted - 04/16/2011:  10:42:22

My fiddle has a fairly harsh sound even after putting strings on it that should mellow it a bit....I ordered a wire mute which cost so very little....I use it all the time....The sound to me is much mellower now tho I wouldn't say sweeter...

Rene - Posted - 04/16/2011:  12:18:55

I'm thinking mute is where it's at, although (my husband's always trying to mute me) I would prefer to find something in the set-up.  I like to fix the problem not mask it.

Rene - Posted - 04/16/2011:  12:30:41

   I think maybe I can justify a new fiddle

hickoryknot - Posted - 04/16/2011:  13:38:19

 I like to fix the problem not mask it........................................

​I agree wit you Rene....

fiddlepogo - Posted - 04/16/2011:  23:41:44

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwalkin

Lots and lots of old fiddlers used the little wire mute. Mostly because it would sweeten up some of those fiddles they had to play. Most of the old timers did not get to choose from an array of fiddles. They ordered one out of a catolog and played it. Probably never even had a true "set up". 

---

I'm sure VERY FEW had what would pass for a true set-up today, but I'm sure they got more home-grown setups, taking a file to the bridge and flattening it and all.  The culture fiddling thrived in is very big on do-it-yourself-ing, and from what oldtimer has said here, some of that setup information was passed on in the tradition.

fiddlepogo - Posted - 04/16/2011:  23:50:57

Rene- one possible way of looking at the double stop thing-

Double stops require a different amount of pressure than playing single strings. After all, the bow has twice as much work to do. But if you sound the double stops successfully, two notes are going to tend to be louder than one (the reason for the harshness)  But if you back off on the pressure to make them softer, they may be prone to squeaking.

My suggestion would be to learn to play some passages or tunes with ALL double stops or drones- that way, you can get more practice with them.

It's like this:  If you play single notes 98% of the time, and double stops 2% of the time, which one are you going to get more practice with and be more comfortable with???

You have to find a way of increasing your double stop and/or drone playing time.

When you're more confident with them, it'll be easier to find the right attack for them in relation to the single note passages.