yoyogogo - Posted - 03/26/2024:  12:17:23

Bought this for a great price. If you want to take a guess, please comment, i think you would be surprise :)

I will pick up this weekend so looking forward to that. I just want to ask for advices from the more experienced members. From the images provided, do you think the violin is of decent quality and value that it might be worth to to spend money at the luthier to setup properly? The cost of it is around $500 NZD, which is significantly more than what i paid for the violin.

I have seen hopf violins going for $2k-$3k in NZ and several thousands on online shops overseas. So certainly if the potential value of the value is in that range, then it makes sense to spend the money. But if its a terrible copy, then it wont.

The violin is for me, an old dad of 3, to learn violin so i can play along with the kids.

Any advices are welcome please.

 

DougD - Posted - 03/26/2024:  12:33:33

"Nach," in German can mean "after," or "in the style of." Thousands of violins with stamps like that were exported from Germany, most with little in common with the real nstruments made by the early Hopf family (although I believe members of that family are still active in the instrument business). Like many, yours doesn't really have the squarish upper shoulders typical of the old ones (see attached photo).
I'm not in the violin business, and others here can probably give you better advice.
There's lots of information about these instruments online. Here's one source: corilon.com/us/library/master-...in-makers

Edited by - DougD on 03/26/2024 12:41:56

Seidel violin back

 

yoyogogo - Posted - 03/26/2024:  13:10:59

ohh i see on that website, along the bottom it shows 4 hopf violins, and YES, they all do have that squarish shape along the top of the violin. Thank you for pointing that out and teaching me.

so at least its like to be made in germany? 20th century?

ChickenMan - Posted - 03/26/2024:  15:49:35

"so at least its like to be made in germany? 20th century?" Probably German, what with the nach and all. Early 20th likely. There were lots of them in circulation at one time.

wilford - Posted - 03/26/2024:  18:07:02

Like just about any fiddle, there's good ones and not-so-good ones. I've owned and or worked on lots of Hopf fiddles. I absolutely do not care for the ones built to let the ribs into the neck. They're no fun to work on. Note: the wood used to build your fiddle looks like good wood and hopefully it will have a wonderful sound. (I bet it sounds great!)

yoyogogo - Posted - 03/26/2024:  18:16:39

quote:

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Originally posted by wilford

Like just about any fiddle, there's good ones and not-so-good ones. I've owned and or worked on lots of Hopf fiddles. I absolutely do not care for the ones built to let the ribs into the neck. They're no fun to work on. Note: the wood used to build your fiddle looks like good wood and hopefully it will have a wonderful sound. (I bet it sounds great!)

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may i please ask how coudl you tell its good wood? 

secondly, ribs into the neck?

a lutheir here in NZ replied back to say, "These Hopf violins with that plain varnish are pretty basic instruments, with non-ebony fingerboards and no proper corner blocks". but they have not looked at the violin of course.

and yes, im hoping for some decent sound too. Im using a rather cheap Roweller, and even that sounds ok for my ears, so surely the chance of this sounding better has to be good :)

ps, i only paid $12usd for this. 

Shawn Craver Fiddler - Posted - 03/26/2024:  19:58:57

Nice looking fiddle. Nothing to be ashamed of. I still remember a good old German "trade" fiddle I let slip through my hands. I wished I would've paid the 120 bucks for it because I never forgot how good it sounded. Definitely get it a proper set up.

yoyogogo - Posted - 03/26/2024:  21:04:58

quote:

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Originally posted by Shawn Craver Fiddler

Nice looking fiddle. Nothing to be ashamed of. I still remember a good old German "trade" fiddle I let slip through my hands. I wished I would've paid the 120 bucks for it because I never forgot how good it sounded. Definitely get it a proper set up.

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thank you for the encouragement :)

i missed out on buying two hopf violins this year, one for $60usd and one was for 250usd. when i saw this, without seeing the back, i figured at $12usd, its a bargain and if its crap, its only $12usd. So i was super happy with the owner sent through the images of the back. 

The Violin Beautiful - Posted - 03/27/2024:  04:19:49

Huge numbers of violins were made just like this one in Saxony in the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries. While they were made cheaply following a production model that did not necessarily include things like corner blocks, a mortised neck, a carefully finished interior, or a glued-in bassbar, they often have the potential to sound nice if you’re willing to invest in the work to make them better. 



True Hopf violins are very different from these instruments, which were given the name of a famous violin making family but were not really copies, much like the violins with the Stainer brand on their backs. It was a gimmick to sell instruments, just like putting Italian-sounding labels into Chinese violins to make them more interesting to buyers today.



As to whether it’s worth taking to your luthier, that really depends on how much the luthier is willing to do to get it working well. Some may refuse outright to work on it because of the amount of work needed or because it won’t strike them as practical.

Edited by - The Violin Beautiful on 03/27/2024 04:21:40

ChickenMan - Posted - 03/27/2024:  21:38:05

quote:

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Originally posted by The Violin Beautiful

As to whether it’s worth taking to your luthier, that really depends on how much the luthier is willing to do to get it working well. Some may refuse outright to work on it because of the amount of work needed or because it won’t strike them as practical.

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This speaks truth to both the wide variety in trade fiddles and luthiers 

I've seen and played some pretty [thin/tubby/nasal/insert your own description of sound that wouldn't likely be the sound you are personally striving towards] sounding fiddles, as well as played some that at the time felt so far above my skill level, like getting into a Formula 1 car driving across town - there is way I'm getting the most out of either those fine violins or that specialized race car. I have two fiddles that are meh but I keep them for sentimental reason. 

To address op, take it in. As Richard says, you won't know until you take it in, and then it might be cost prohibitive or not worth the time needed compared to the ultimate end results. 

Also, did you say you paid 500 or that is the cost of set up?

yoyogogo - Posted - 03/27/2024:  21:53:46

Hi @ChickenMan I bought for only $12usd, but it would be around $300usd, or $500nzd to setup. the annoying thign is that i live in a small town, so it takes a few hours to go to the nearest luthier. pain in the butt.

yoyogogo - Posted - 03/27/2024:  22:01:45

quote:

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Originally posted by ChickenMan

quote:

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Originally posted by The Violin Beautiful

 

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Hi ChickenMan @ChickenMan I bought for only $12usd, but it would be around $300usd, or $500nzd to setup. the annoying thign is that i live in a small town, so it takes a few hours to go to the nearest luthier. pain in the butt.

Shawn Craver Fiddler - Posted - 03/28/2024:  09:14:16

looks good from the pictures. looks as if it has been used/played. a luthier will tell you if it doesn't deserve a proper set up.

The Violin Beautiful - Posted - 03/28/2024:  17:17:51

quote:

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Originally posted by yoyogogo

Hi @ChickenMan I bought for only $12usd, but it would be around $300usd, or $500nzd to setup. the annoying thign is that i live in a small town, so it takes a few hours to go to the nearest luthier. pain in the butt.

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That's pretty reasonable as an amount for setup. You could almost definitely get more out of it with revoicing, although that would involve a more serious investment. With only $12 in it so far, that wouldn't be unreasonable. It comes down to how much you want to spend on this violin vs. what you can get from something else. Old German violins that have been given the full treatment are hard to beat under $5000USD. 

yoyogogo - Posted - 03/28/2024:  17:20:59

quote:

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Originally posted by The Violin Beautiful

quote:

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Originally posted by yoyogogo

Hi @ChickenMan I bought for only $12usd, but it would be around $300usd, or $500nzd to setup. the annoying thign is that i live in a small town, so it takes a few hours to go to the nearest luthier. pain in the butt.

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That's pretty reasonable as an amount for setup. You could almost definitely get more out of it with revoicing, although that would involve a more serious investment. With only $12 in it so far, that wouldn't be unreasonable. It comes down to how much you want to spend on this violin vs. what you can get from something else. Old German violins that have been given the full treatment are hard to beat under $5000USD. 

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You mentioned revoicing.  Is this different to setup?

Money wise it's more about the worth if the violin after cost. E.g if I pay 1000usd to make it suoer nice and the violin is qorth 2000usd then it makes sense. But even if I spend 300usd and afterwards it only worth 100uzd then no point. I guess that my logical mind working anyway :)