TuneWeaver - Posted - 11/09/2022:  08:38:25

So, do you measure the string spacing center-to-center? or do you consider the thickness of the stings and make the SPACES equal ? I've always kept the spaces equal even if the center-to-center is then off a little.. Which is the 'correct' way to space strings?

Edited by - TuneWeaver on 11/09/2022 08:44:43

The Violin Beautiful - Posted - 11/09/2022:  09:46:31

quote:

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Originally posted by TuneWeaver

So, do you measure the string spacing center-to-center? or do you consider the thickness of the stings and make the SPACES equal ? I've always kept the spaces equal even if the center-to-center is then off a little.. Which is the 'correct' way to space strings?

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The answer depends on who you ask. The majority of luthiers space the strings center-to-center, but there are a few who equalize the spacing from edge to edge. 

 

I prefer to measure center-to-center because the middle of the finger goes onto the center of the string when playing, not in between. I also don't like the idea that the string spacing would have to be adjusted if you switched strings. The spacing for the G and E is determined by the center of the strings in either method anyway, then the middle strings follow. If you adjust for the spaces in between, you have to spend a lot more time adjusting the string positions with a caliper, and there's a good chance that the spaces will end up uneven after all that fuss. 

Edited by - The Violin Beautiful on 11/09/2022 09:50:43

Lonesome Fiddler - Posted - 11/09/2022:  14:02:50

For me, the distances between the strings is more a bowing issue than a fingering/stopping one. Ya can't say fretting with a fiddle! With every fiddle I've ever owned...and I still own three out of the four I ever bought...the issue is how easily I can simultaneously bow two adjacent strings when the mood (or the tune) tells me to.

Brian Wood - Posted - 11/09/2022:  14:34:22

quote:

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Originally posted by Lonesome Fiddler

For me, the distances between the strings is more a bowing issue than a fingering/stopping one. Ya can't say fretting with a fiddle! With every fiddle I've ever owned...and I still own three out of the four I ever bought...the issue is how easily I can simultaneously bow two adjacent strings when the mood (or the tune) tells me to.

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I agree with that. It is sometimes remarkable how string spacing at the nut isn't much of an issue when playing. You get used to it quickly. That said, there is every reason to set it up correctly so that anyone playing the instrument will find it comfortable, and anyone looking at it won't find fault. A mandolin I built last year had issues with the original nut and I hastily tried something to fix the issue. The spacing on the quick fix nut was actually pretty sloppy. But it solved the problem and I got used to it quickly and sort of forgot about it until I was showing off my instrument to a luthier I had just met. He liked the mando a lot but said "you know about this issue, right?" pointing to the nut. I am making a new nut today, and it's worth fixing just for the respect of people whose judgment I respect, and it might just play better, too. For both fiddle and mandolin I agree about evenly centering the spacing. For mandolin that the center point between puts each pair of strings.

If I recall,  few years ago I read that Sam Bush preferred his string spacing at the nut to be equal, that is all 8 strings equally spaced. That sounds weird so maybe I've got it wrong...

Brian Wood - Posted - 11/09/2022:  15:25:29

PS I just realized the topic is bridge spacing, not nut spacing (even says that in topic line). Duh. But since I referred to nut spacing I think it's useful to talk about both. And I agree with Rich about bridge spacing.

NCnotes - Posted - 11/10/2022:  12:22:48

quote:

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Originally posted by Lonesome Fiddler

For me, the distances between the strings is more a bowing issue than a fingering/stopping one. Ya can't say fretting with a fiddle! With every fiddle I've ever owned...and I still own three out of the four I ever bought...the issue is how easily I can simultaneously bow two adjacent strings when the mood (or the tune) tells me to.

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I have heard that fiddlers like their bridge "flatter", which makes it easier to play two strings at once? Since I play mostly Irish + classical, I didn't feel any need for that, but I'd be curious to try an instrument with a "flatter" bridge arc someday and see if it does make bowing doublestops easier! 

TuneWeaver - Posted - 11/10/2022:  12:56:36

quote:

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Originally posted by NCnotes

quote:

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Originally posted by Lonesome Fiddler

For me, the distances between the strings is more a bowing issue than a fingering/stopping one. Ya can't say fretting with a fiddle! With every fiddle I've ever owned...and I still own three out of the four I ever bought...the issue is how easily I can simultaneously bow two adjacent strings when the mood (or the tune) tells me to.

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I have heard that fiddlers like their bridge "flatter", which makes it easier to play two strings at once? Since I play mostly Irish + classical, I didn't feel any need for that, but I'd be curious to try an instrument with a "flatter" bridge arc someday and see if it does make bowing doublestops easier! 

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A flatter bridge does NOT make it easier to play two strings at once.  WHat it does do is make it easier to jump from any set of TWO strings, over to having a  Different set of two strings... For instance, if you are playing AE together..no problem, so a flatter bridge makes the AD strings  easier to get to from the AE.. In other words, you can go Easier for AE to AD!!   Does that make sense? 

Many good fiddlers don't have flattened bridges.. Also a flattened bridge makes it, for instance, to go from an E, to the D..

with just the slightest nuance of a movement with the fingers/wrist.  Another thing involved with this  is often a SHORTER bridge..I'm sure experts will elaborate on this.. Maybe you could start a new topic about it?  Seems you have an interesting topic to bring up.. that is.. flat bridges..Lee

Edited by - TuneWeaver on 11/10/2022 13:04:06

TuneWeaver - Posted - 11/10/2022:  13:42:05

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Originally posted by Brian Wood

PS I just realized the topic is bridge spacing, not nut spacing (even says that in topic line). Duh. But since I referred to nut spacing I think it's useful to talk about both. And I agree with Rich about bridge spacing.

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Rich said, "it depends on who you ask".. I like the comments, but Personally I think I'll stick to equal spacing between the sides of the string and not the centers... Probably won't matter much considering that I have terrible hearing and won't notice the difference, but I like the LOOK of equal spaces/off center..!!

NCnotes - Posted - 11/10/2022:  14:25:45

re-flatter bridge-

Thanks Lee, I did not know that! That's interesting!
I had heard that fiddlers prefer "flatter" bridges, but had thought it was in order to play doublestops.
(Sorry for thread drift :-) Ok back to thread)

The Violin Beautiful - Posted - 11/11/2022:  18:05:12

quote:

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Originally posted by NCnotes

re-flatter bridge-



Thanks Lee, I did not know that! That's interesting!

I had heard that fiddlers prefer "flatter" bridges, but had thought it was in order to play doublestops.

(Sorry for thread drift :-) Ok back to thread)

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It IS true that fiddlers often prefer flatter bridges to make double stops (or triple stops or chords) easier. As you flatten the curve, it inevitably brings the strings closer to being on the same plane. If you make the bridge too flat, it becomes an issue because you start hitting strings when you don't want to do so.

I would say that it's not really that hard to play double stops on a "classical bridge," and I have seen a few examples where luthiers were able to trick fiddlers into thinking their bridges were flatter by using a regular curve and shaping the corners  a little differently. That being said, there is still demand for flatter bridges, and some players will ask for the curve to be flattened until they feel more at home playing lots of double stops. 

Edited by - The Violin Beautiful on 11/11/2022 18:20:23

The Violin Beautiful - Posted - 11/11/2022:  18:33:02

I would add that another approach players have taken to playing multiple notes simultaneously with more ease is the “Bach bow.” Joe Venuti would do his “Four String Joe” technique so he could play full chords. A flat bridge would accomplish this as well.

Here’s TwoSet playing around with bridge curves:
youtu.be/XEQLxstx6TU

NCnotes - Posted - 11/11/2022:  20:30:03

That was actually a really interesting video and I appreciate my bridge more!