GSCarson - Posted - 07/08/2007:  10:00:56

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I realize that maple is "the " material of choice for a violin/fiddle bridge. But after reading the bridge profile thread (which is interesting), the thought about different bridge wood materials popped into mind, especially as I was looking at the link with all the subtle differences in bridge profiles. As a banjo builder, many of us have used all kinds of woods for our tone rings (integral open back banjo rings) and bridges as an alternative to maple, sometimes with really great and unexpected results. I haven't ever experimented with my own fiddle bridge materials, but wondered if anyone has tried or experimented with anything else. For example, my mandolin is made of Oregon myrtle (spruce top) as an alternative to maple, and it really sounds great, with great warmth and volume. I have made banjo bridges of grenadillo, varieties of walnut, myrtle, ebony, etc. Wondered how off the wall this thought might be in the world of violin making and set up.
G. Carson

Gronk - Posted - 07/08/2007:  12:42:55

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I wonder if there are any submerged wood bridges in maple or birch. Shurely by now someone has tried it.

M-D - Posted - 07/08/2007:  13:09:50

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I had the same idea about using submerged woods, and have some dedicated for this, but have not gotten around to cutting it.

I do know a couple of fiddlers who have their bridges made from bone. Both were hand-made by the same man. Both sound good, and both use Prim strings. The heart area is really opened up, as are the kidneys. Dont know how much experimenting, nor tinkering it took to get them sounding good. I'll run into the maker one day soon and I'll ask him about it. The other fella' said it sure did stink whilst he was working on them. If youi've ever cut/ground/filed/drilled dry bone, you know what he's talking about.

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M-D

Music is found in the space between the notes -- in the silence between the chords. Get your spaces right, and you've got it. ~ Albert Greenfield

Rustylee - Posted - 07/08/2007:  13:11:26

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Glenn,
I was wondering about that the other day in terms of the characteristics that are needed for different parts of the instrument. I know dogwood it pretty tough. So tough in fact that old mountain folks used to use them to split softer woods in place of an iron wedge. The dogwood was a called a glut. I've also heard Osage orange is pretty hard, but I've never worked with any of it.

Rusty <><

M-D - Posted - 07/08/2007:  14:29:39

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One of the old-timers in these hills worked in wood as his trade. When it came time for his fiddle to need a new tail-piece, he made one himself -- out of dogwood.

Osage orange (bois d'arc, bodock, etc.) is the most dense of the native hardwoods. Black locust is the second. I have to wonder how suitable either would be for a fiddle bridge, given this density . . . especially if it's long aged and been under ground.

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M-D

Music is found in the space between the notes -- in the silence between the chords. Get your spaces right, and you've got it. ~ Albert Greenfield

captainhook - Posted - 07/08/2007:  20:38:08

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Spruce makes great bridges for some fiddles, often with significant improvement in sound (not just my opinion). A couple of people have told me they made their steel strings sound like gut. My last two fiddles have them. I'll have to try maple one of these days to see how it compares. Dogwood can work, but you have to be very careful not to get it too heavy or too flexible. For other things like fingerboards, nuts and tailpieces dogwood is fine.

captainhook

superdave2112 - Posted - 07/09/2007:  03:38:21

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A while back, I spent the money on an Aubert "A" Mirecourt Deluxe bridge. It's supposed to be the big enchilada. I bought it locally for $37, if I remember right. Had to have it right then. Couldn't wait. You know how it is.

It was as hard as a rock. Took me twice as long to fit. The results were night and day. The bow responce difference was like comparing high speed internet to dial up. The sound was louder, clearer, and more focused. I'm sold!

I ordered two more, on line, from Tulsa Violin. This time, I think it was $25, or so. Much better price!

Anyway, I was gonna do some experiments before all this, with some aged black walnut that I have saved for banjo stuff (nice dark banjo sound), but I lost a lot of my motivation after trying the fancy French Maple stuff. Wow!

So, anybody try black walnut yet?

David



Hey, my stick's crooked!

GSCarson - Posted - 07/09/2007:  09:52:34

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The submerged wood crossed my mind too, l'll bet that would be really interesting. I've done some banjo work with it, and it does effect the tone, usually in a positive way. Also the old factory floor maple that First Quality (Sullivan) sells for their banjo bridges and rims... I've had a couple fiddles that had a somewhat harsh E string, and also thought about a bridge that had something different spliced in under that to warm it up. Walnut (English/French, etc) has worked well on banjo bridges for this purpose. Of course reading about David's experience with good old high quality maple makes me want to rush off and buy one of those bridge blanks too....
.

M-D - Posted - 07/09/2007:  10:07:48

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I have a dwindling stash of 75-100 year old Aubert a Mirecourt bridges. They, as David said, do define "hard rock" maple, and take longer to cut; but, what they'll bring out of the instrument is amazing. I'll be sad to see these gone.

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M-D

Music is found in the space between the notes -- in the silence between the chords. Get your spaces right, and you've got it. ~ Albert Greenfield

oldtimer - Posted - 07/10/2007:  14:16:45

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quote:

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Originally posted by GSCarson

.... I've had a couple fiddles that had a somewhat harsh E string, and also thought about a bridge that had something different spliced in under that to warm it up. Walnut (English/French, etc) has worked well on banjo bridges for this purpose.....

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A walnut bridge really mellows out a banjo. I have always wanted to try a walnut fiddle bridge on harsh fiddles. I wish someone sold them...I have made banjo bridges, but fiddle bridges are too intricate for me.I think I will try a walnut splice on a piercing Maggini copy I have.

stay tooned....
Glenn Godsey

"Time passes unhindered"

krugwaffle - Posted - 07/11/2007:  01:45:35

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When I saw this topic on the list the first wood that came to mind was the Osage Orange. Let us know how it comes out M-D if you do get around to trying it. I want to try to get my hands on some to try carving into fittings but it don't grow around here. If it does, I haven't seen any. I take a vacation up to North Alabama every year so I'll just look around for some while I'm up there.

The bone bridge is an interesting idea. Having shaped many a guitar nut I can sympathize with the fellow that carved the bridges. Smells like you're sanding a dead squirrel. Bone has the quality of having many densities too. Depending on how it's been cooked or bleached, it can be very greasy or very chalky or anything in between. A heavy/dense bridge could be altered a little at a time by removing the grease until a desired effect was acheived. Interesting enough to send me looking for some large bone slabs to try out.

I've also wondered about persimmon wood. Any luck out there with it as a bridge material? When I think about high density woods I also think of briar wood, but it's not very straight grained or consistent. How about sweet gum? Difficult to season without checking but incredibly hard when dry. At least that's the case with the gum that's growing down here. I sawed a slab off a green limb that was damaged during the hurricanes and let it dry in the garage. It was about 1/4" thick and about 8" in diameter. A year later, it fell from it's cubbyhole and clattered on the floor. Rang like a bell. It had curled up like a potato chip but wasn't checked or split. After I tried to scratch it with my pocket knife, I tossed it in the trash since I thought it too tough to whittle into anything. I'm thinking I'll give the next fallen limb a chance as raw material to cut some bridges from.

Another Florida anomaly... Citrus tree wood is like a white ebony. Almost no visible grain, extremely slow growing, very hard when cured... Next time I run across a useable quantity, I'm going to try seasoning some out for fiddle parts. Could make anything from nuts to tailpieces. Might be a little too flexible for a bridge. Imagine a white fingerboard! Actually smells good too!

GSCarson - Posted - 07/11/2007:  08:40:05

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krugwaffle posted - "I've also wondered about persimmon wood. Any luck out there with it as a bridge material? "

I think persimmon might be another good choice to experiment with. I am presently building a banjo for my son with an integral persimmon tone ring on a pot turned by Ohio builder Dave Large, and I've heard several banjos built by Dave or Mike Ramsey that really sound great.

Sometimes it seems that we get into a little bit if a box with what is "acceptable" wood for building instruments, particularly violins... I know I have been that way. One thing that got me thinking about other woods years ago was due to a long time friendship with autoharp builder George Orthy, who lives near me. George started to build a few themed autoharps for some special friends he had made, including the Carters and Stonemans. He used wood from their family farms to build the harps, was also trying some other woods, such as mulberry, and he even moved his sound board to the back of some of the harps, etc. These harps sound great! Woke me up to some other possibilitities.