vrteach - Posted - 07/19/2010:  10:00:25

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Hi,
My choice for TOTW is "Cherokee Shuffle", which I learned fairly recently (since 2008) from people in the local jam. It's turned into one of my permanent (so far) favorites. I was taught it in A.

Let us get my version out of the way first:
fiddlehangout.com/myhangout/me...archived=


No TOTW is complete without a reference (assuming one exists) to the Fiddlers Companion: ibiblio.org/fiddlers/CHER_CHUR...E_SHUFFLE

and a portion of that entry states:

quote:

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Banjo player Howard Bursen, fiddler Kerry Blech and others, identify the tune as a West Coast version of "Lonesome Indian," and that it was derived from fiddler Tommy Magness who recorded the "Indian" tune in the 1930's. Tommy Jackson is generally credited with transforming Magness' "Lonesome Indian" (in the key of 'D') into "Cherokee Shuffle" (in the key of 'A'). Jackson also added a distinctive second part. The Magness tune also became known as "Lost Indian" subsequently, says Kerry Blech, especially among older fiddlers in North Carolina and Virginia "Some of these folks even took Tommy Jackson's addition and stuck it onto the Magness tune, after transposing, of course." To add to the confusion between the two tunes, "Cherokee Shuffle" is also sometimes played in the key of 'D', although the 'A' version seems more common. Regarding the form of the tune, there appears to be two versions of "Cherokee Suffle" in current circulation, one "square" (with the 'A' and 'B' parts the same length) and one not. Along with "Lonesome Indian" (or "Lost Indian [3]" as it is sometimes known), the melody "Colored Aristocracy" bears some resemblance to "Cherokee Shuffle."

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I, however, had heard the Illinois version of "Lost Indian" played in A (fiddle) and G (tenor banjo). I pretty much just modified what I do for "Cherokee Shuffle" and played along. On my web site I've included a 6-minute version of Lost Indian at a campfire session in Gilman, Illinois, on a September evening of 2009: vrteach.org/content/cherokee-shuffle

There is a discussion of the "Cherokee Shuffle/Lost Indian" subject archived from the manoline list dating from 1992-2000 at: nigelgatherer.com/mando/comand.../005.html

There was also a discussion of this tune here on the fiddle hangout last year:

fiddlehangout.com/topic/10187/


Now on to recording links. This tune is one of those that is equally popular among Old-Time and Bluegrass folks, and as such shows up all over the place.

Here are some from the FHO (after a really quick search) by David M

FiddlenNick

and

Garry Sizemore

and the token youtube entry:

youtube.com/watch?v=vYduAMqy-Z8

Erich

PS: Yesterday I played Cherokee Shuffle at the monthly Illinois Old-tyme (sic) Fiddlers Association Gathering, and almost nobody knew it. I was disappointed.

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Edited by - vrteach on 07/19/2010 10:03:23

hendrid - Posted - 07/19/2010:  10:38:25

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Nice tune Erich. The indians and Cherokee keeps cropping up and nice stuff. For us learners off your Nigel stuff above for those interested a fairly clean ABC version in D and link to a sheet music version

nigelgatherer.com/mando/comand.../005.html

From: Nigel Gatherer Date: Tue, 07 Sep 1999 16:50:00
I've just found a version of Cherokee Shuffle that I tabbed out ages ago (click here). Note that there are quite a few different ways of playing "Cherokee Shuffle", and this is just one of them.

X:074
T:Cherokee Shuffle
N:An amalgam, a lot of Steve Kaufman
M:4/4
L:1/8
K:D
A,2 B,2 C2|D2 DF EDB,A,|DEDB, A,2 A,B,|D2 DE F2 A2|B2 BB B2 Bc|
d2 d2 d2 B2|ABAAG FEDE|FEDE F2 A2|B2 BB B2 dB|ABAG F2 E2|D2:|]
d2 c2 =c2|BABc d2 B2|ABAG F2 dc|BABc d2 e2|f2 ff f2 dc|BABc d2 B2|
ABAAG FEDE|FEDE F2 A2|B2 BB B2 dB|ABAG F2 E2|D2:|]

sheet music from Nigel

nigelgatherer.com/tunes/tab/tab1/cher.html

Also in Fiddlers Fakebook in key of A, Page 65. Little less notey than Nigel"s

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Edited by - hendrid on 07/19/2010 10:41:45

scrubber - Posted - 07/19/2010:  10:42:43

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IMO, what distinguishes Cherokee Shuffle from Lost Indian is the chord that initiates the 'B' part, irrespective of the key. CS begins with the subdominant (IV) while LI begins with the tonic (I) (and there can also be a third part is LI).

I enjoy playin' both, CS usually in A and LI in D.

dave

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Edited by - scrubber on 07/19/2010 10:45:39

Leon Grizzard - Posted - 07/20/2010:  13:22:30

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Great tune. Here's Elana James:

youtube.com/watch?v=UEkbKhpcCCs

Eric Sprado - Posted - 07/20/2010:  14:06:19

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I learned Lost Indian over in Missouri in the sixties. Went over there once from Kansas to do some horseshoeing and there was some fiddling going on in the town for some reason. A great big lady in a blue flower print dress,roll up hose(like my first grade teacher wore) and lace up blocky heeled shoes played it and buck danced at the same time!! Just as clear in my minds eye as the day I was there... I still love to just RIP into that tune..... On the minor chord (I play tune in D) I play a double stop with F# on the D string and B on the A string. I slide that double stop down(toward nut) and back to give the tune a sort of Oriental sound. Take that lick and run with it if you'd like......

coelhoe - Posted - 07/25/2010:  08:38:29

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I first heard "Lost Indian" from a fiddler from Kentucky who was living in Idaho Falls around 1968. a fine player with the last name of Jones. "Cherokee Shuffle" I first heard on an album from the early '70's by a semi-OT group from San Francisco called "The Arkansas Sheiks." The name of the band comes from a much older group who recorded from the late '20's. I would listen to the record quite a bit because of the really excellent and very quick clawhammer ( so I thought at the time) banjo break on the tune. I couldn't figure out how it was done.

Later I discovered that the banjo break was actually played on a tenor banjo, which seemed like cheating somehow. Anyway, it was a good album and by then the tune was embedded in my mind, but it pretty much displaced "Lost Indian," which I can't really recall anymore.

DougD - Posted - 07/25/2010:  08:49:58

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Tony Marcus (among others) played banjo in the Arkansas Sheiks. I remember backing him up in the banjo contest at Galax in the early 1970's, where he played five string. I wonder if he played the tenor break on "Cherokee Shuffle?"

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Edited by - DougD on 07/25/2010 09:20:15