Ok, maybe not a rut, but I'm in the midst of the mother of all plateaus. I've been playing for five years now and I don't think I've seen any type of progress in about six months or more, other than adding a few more tunes to my repertoire. I'm stuck at the same speed (I may have even regressed a bit), I haven't mastered any new positions, or gotten any better at the capo keys. Bowing is stuck too. I practice regularly and play with others frequently. Maybe, at the tender age of 65, this is as good as I'm gonna get?
I play 100% by ear, because that's fun for me. Maybe I should learn to sight read next?
If I didn't read I don't think I would've made it very far along my 50 year journey, music notation opens up the whole world music. I am amazed that many fiddlers can stay with one genre unlike me I like to play a bit of every thing. I did the 'start-stop' learning from cassette tape just to prove I can pick it up ear, but what the heck I can read right off the page, saves a heap of time, and it doesnt matter how I learnt a tune I can still memorise in the same way. I've done the 'play-by-ear-old-time-session', quit easy tunes, but an up-tempo 'Irish Sesh', a very different thing. I did the slow down thing too when the 'Hungarian Gypsy' came to town I transcribed many tunes, as I did with some D. Swarbrick renditions. I memorized quite a few, but there's so many pieces I'll never fall in a rut. I like to accompany singer/guitarists, I started that very early on because I had many friends who sang and strummed. Presently I'm focusing on honing my improvisation skills, at the same time maintaining my repertoire, there's always something new to learn.
Hitting a plateau can happen for a couple reasons. One is that the learning that’s going on internally hasn’t shown a physical result yet. This happens a lot with technical learning, where it can feel like there is no progress at all until something clicks mentally and the hurdle suddenly disappears. Progress in violin playing is not always at the same rate of speed.
The other reason, though, is a lack of the tools to progress. This happens to a lot of self-taught players. When you’re trying to teach yourself, you’re not fully aware of your limitations or how to go about overcoming them. A good teacher has the experience to be able to pinpoint problems and suggest a course of study that will strengthen weak areas in technique. Some areas are related to each other, so a problem in one compounds issues in others.
Learning to read is a great and invaluable resource for anyone who has an interest in music. It does not hinder appreciation or understanding of folk music, but rather aids one in picking it up. I wouldn’t view it as a solution for technical problems in playing, though. For that you need help identifying the problems with the left and right hands that you likely can’t determine alone. Learning to read music will open up the door to a wealth of music (plenty of folk music has been written down and was learned that way originally) and will give you more to absorb if you’ve become apathetic from a scarcity of variety in tunes.
Early on, plateaus are common, because you don't know what you don't know! Some suggestions:
I think plateaus are pretty normal. In all my music life, learning never seems to be a steady incline…it’s like, plateau for a while and then a spurt! And then realize you can do that thing you’ve been practicing for awhile, it finally sank in.
Are there specific things you want to get better at?
You could seek out other players / mentors/ teachers if you want a “jumpstart”. ( For me, I want to get better at jig bowing and rolls…so I might take a lesson or two this fall…because listening to music tracks only gets you so far…plus I figure, why not support good/pro players by taking a few lessons from them if you can afford to? :-)
Or, you could just relax and enjoy music and life. No need to pressure ourselves to be constantly improving…that can put you in a bad headspace, I think…I’ve been there (mostly when I played classical).
I see by your bio you already play a bunch of other instruments. I usually recommend that. Lately I've been exploring where the fiddle fits 'within' the music.
Imagine if you could never play the fiddle after some event. This usually primes me.
Micheal Jordan used to create scenarios to get himself motivated before a game. Best of Luck
Wanted to add that weirdly, one of the biggest leaps in my playing was when I was injured!
I had time limits on music …first playing 5 min/day, then 10 min/day, then 15 min/day, as I recovered.
in that very short amount of time, there’s no time to play “numbly” or mindlessly or for the heck of it. Every note, every bow stroke, had to matter and mean something before that clock ran out. Only very favorite tunes had time to get played.
And oddly, I think my playing became more soulful, more “Me” in that time…and I realized that I’m going to bring that with me always…to try to never play a note that doesn’t sound good to me. I kind of found my own voice in those injured days… because there wasn’t enough time to sit around copying other players, playing along with YouTubes, etc. like I usually do.
Nothing wrong with a rut if you can make it groove... One person's rut is another's goal!
I was watching a pretty popular fiddler lately and it hit me how much they kind of do the same thing with the bow over and over... I'd go mad fiddling like that, but people eat it up...so... more power to 'em
I'm convinced you only face your limits when you actually tell yourself there might be such a thing as a personal level where all progress will stop and start to believe this.
To answer your last question:
I can still sight read a bit - not the difficult stuff anymore - I only see the notes and certain rhytms, I do not see the tralala around the notes/ more complicated symbols/indications of bowing directions or tune structure....I don't need that anyhow or shall I say: I do not want it.
Since a couple of days I am having a renewed look at the tune Midnight On The Water (which I once before tried to learn, as a beginner, I used sheet music back then) and today I found many other different written out versions of this tune on abcnotation.com. And yes for this specific tune this is very helpful: a glance at one or the other version is followed by me experimenting with what I can add and vary myself that sounds and feels like really me. Each version gives different results for this pseudo/semi -improvizing experiment and that is to me highly entertaining.
I can relate. So, you're not alone! Just today, I found a guy on Youtube that made sense to me. Not sure why but his method and ways he demonstrated made more sense. Basically, it was 4 closed positions to play a Major Pentatonic Scale and 4 positions to play a Minor Pentatonic scale...movable to any key. I knew this information was there...I understand it but the way he showed it made more sense to me. This is helpful because I'm in a rut if you will and this discovery just rekindled that flame. By the time this thread gets going, you'll have a nice boost hopefully!
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Originally posted by dorymanOk, maybe not a rut, but I'm in the midst of the mother of all plateaus. I've been playing for five years now and I don't think I've seen any type of progress in about six months or more, other than adding a few more tunes to my repertoire. I'm stuck at the same speed (I may have even regressed a bit), I haven't mastered any new positions, or gotten any better at the capo keys. Bowing is stuck too. I practice regularly and play with others frequently. Maybe, at the tender age of 65, this is as good as I'm gonna get?
I play 100% by ear, because that's fun for me. Maybe I should learn to sight read next?
Hey, I'm turning 80 this August and am always getting better and better at being mediocre..!! Try BUSKING.. That may give you a boost..
Thanks all for the thoughtful responses. To be clear, I'm not in a motivational rut, I love to play, I play a lot and I play with a lot of people. I'm just not seeing any progress. Of course this may all just be an artifact of the fact that the slow progress I make now pales in comparison to the rapid progress one makes at the beginning of a musical journey.
I think Rich, and others, hit the nail on the head regarding being self taught, and the need now for good a good teacher (for a variety of reasons). As Al, above said, I don't know what I don't know!
Try something totally crazy on the fiddle...either you'll love what you come up with, or you'll go back to the old stuff and find that you have progressed since going crazy...lol. That oughta work.
For me progress is uneven. There are plateaus with little apparent progress and then there are streaks of big and interesting progress. Gotta be patient with yourself...
I play fiddle and mandolin, and the tag-team interaction between the two keeps things moving forward. On a day when the fiddle doesn’t seem to be working very well, mandolin picks up the momentum. And vice-versa.
Also, playing mando teaches me how to improve my fiddle playing. And vice versa.
I would support what "The Violin Beautiful" has said above about the lack of tools to progress.
He said: "The other reason, though, is a lack of the tools to progress. This happens to a lot of self-taught players. When you’re trying to teach yourself, you’re not fully aware of your limitations or how to go about overcoming them. A good teacher has the experience to be able to pinpoint problems and suggest a course of study that will strengthen weak areas in technique. Some areas are related to each other, so a problem in one compounds issues in others."
I was about 12 years in on fiddle and a friend said, "You know you're not too bad for a self-taught fiddler, but you could probably benefit from some lessons." Since he is one of the two people that I trust in their comments about my ability, my head came up. Always thought that my fiddling heroes didn't take lessons so I should probably avoid lessons too. Turns out that was a mistake. I found a local classical teacher, told him I was a fiddler but wanted to get better at old-time fiddling, not become a classical player. I used tunes I knew and told him what I had difficulty with and he helped me on technique to improve. The change has been amazing. I took only about 5 lessons the first time and had enough to work on for a couple of years. Just returned for another 3 lessons and it has again made a difference. I am finally not embarrassed about my playing. Realizing we are all different in how we learn but this really worked for me. Possibly a way for you to move out of your rut. Have to add that you obviously need to find the right teacher as I have heard from others who got nothing out of lessons at all, so there is that side of it too.
The right teacher is essential. A classical teacher who will try to imbue you with classical techniques and try to mold you as THEY see fit, or throw theory at you that you are not able to digest yet - wrong teacher. Good Luck!
I think the OP has identified the areas he wishes to improve, but hasn't taken the task to seek out the remedies for these specific techniques. The internet is full of short instructional videos, and tons of online teachers which will gladly address these specific techniques.
Even here on FHO we've covered the mentioned techniques countless times, and would, without hesitation address these same topics again.
I'm stuck at the same speed
Playing fast requires 'minimal tension and pressure'. How relaxed do the knuckles feel, tightness will impede movement. Is there too much pressure on the string, pressing down too hard will make it harder to lift the finger. The string doesn't need to be always pressed down to the fingerboard.
I haven't mastered any new positions, or gotten any better at the capo keys.
Third position is good to learn after first because the 1st finger can be matched with the open string like the 3rd is. And this becomes the 'capo key' if the open string is avoided it can be played the same way in first position.
Bowing is stuck too.
Seek out the umpteen topics on 'bowing patterns' and practice them. And don't forget the bow arm/wrist/fingers only require 'minimal tension' also.
To me that's how it's done; identify the areas that need improvement and focus on that until completely understood how it's practiced.
