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Dec 26, 2024 - 7:41:11 AM
4 posts since 12/23/2016

I am looking for information on A & F Reel - recordings, where, when, by whom it was collected, sheet music/tabs, any other source I may have overlooked. I have searched this forum (both media and tabs), the Traditional Tune Archive, Slippery Hill, and general searches on the web at large. No joy so far. Any help is appreciated, thank you.

I have used these search terms: A & F, "A & F", A&F, "A&F", A and F, "A and F".

Bill

Edited by - billbraun on 12/26/2024 07:50:56

Dec 26, 2024 - 8:31:43 AM
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6957 posts since 9/26/2008

What's your source for this title? It's an odd key change pairing for a traditional reel, if its name reflects that, like so many tunes do (D and A Schottische comes to mind).

Edited by - ChickenMan on 12/26/2024 08:32:00

Dec 26, 2024 - 8:37:14 AM

4 posts since 12/23/2016

I heard it in an Old Time jam. I did contact that person today, and she doesn't know/remember anything about the tune.

This is my best, albeit fuzzy, recollection of the chord chart.

a:    |A---|A---|A---|G---|
        |A---|F---|G---|A---:||
b:    |A---|A---|A---|G---|
        |A---|F---|G---|A---:||

Bill

Edited by - billbraun on 12/26/2024 08:45:47

Dec 26, 2024 - 1:32:10 PM
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DaBru

USA

2 posts since 8/12/2009

Jake & Sarah Owen have a tune called "A to F Reel" on their album. I do believe it is the same tune as "Henry Reed's Breakdown", collected and performed by Alan Jabbour. He said that Henry Reed was the sole source for the tune and that he gave no name to the tune - So, Alan named it Henry Reed's Breakdown. This is from Alan Jabbours "Fiddle Tunes Illuminated" book. Don't know if this is the tune you are thinking of, but maybe? Here's a YouTube search with many versions: youtube.com/results?search_que...breakdown

Dec 26, 2024 - 6:04:50 PM

6957 posts since 9/26/2008

I don't hear those chords matching that tune though. Maybe someone would play that; I've heard some pretty "creative" chord choices.

Dec 27, 2024 - 3:13:34 AM

DougD

USA

12431 posts since 12/2/2007
Online Now

Don't know if this was the tune you were thinking of, but "Henry Reed's Breakdown" was first just described as "Unnamed" when Alan recorded it, and later as "Breakdown in A" (one of several tunes with that style of naming). As familiarity with the actual collection has faded over a couple generations, its received its current title, but its certainly not the only "breakdown" Mr. Reed played. A similar thing happened with the tune collected by Samuel Bayard and published as "#33 Old Reel." People started refering to it as "Sarah Armstrong's Tune" and then just "Sarah Armstrong's." I think this also happens a lot in Irish music.
Here's Henry Reed playing the tune, and again accompanied by Gene Reed:
loc.gov/item/afcreed000194/
loc.gov/item/afcreed000193/
I think if I were playing this on guitar I'd just stick with A and E, so maybe its not what you were looking for.

Edited by - DougD on 12/27/2024 03:17:35

Dec 27, 2024 - 9:49:04 AM

4 posts since 12/23/2016

To Bill, Bill, and Doug,

Many thanks for your help. Bill Reynolds, do you know of an outlet for Jake & Sarah Owen's [Eponymous] CD? I was unsuccessful finding a web site for the named label Yodel-Ay-Hee.

Bill Kearney, I have a few recordings of Henry Reed's Breakdown. I agree that the F chord doesn't fit. That said, the F chord fit real well into the A & F Reel played by my friend. Now that I've played the tune in my head a few times, I think the chord chart above is close.

Doug, thanks for the link to the LOC recordings. Coincidentally, I just came across a reference to #33 ("Old Reel") in the Hill Country Tunes. It was paired with The Blacksmith, tune #69.

My plan is to ask the person who played A & F Reel to record it, and do a final check on the chord chart.

Thanks again to everyone for their knowledge and generous time.

Bill

Dec 27, 2024 - 1:04:14 PM

6957 posts since 9/26/2008

If I recall, Old Reel 33 is what folks call Sarah Armstrong's Reel.

Dec 27, 2024 - 1:40:52 PM
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DaBru

USA

2 posts since 8/12/2009

Unfortunately, I think the Yodel-Ay-Hee label is no longer in business. The Jake and Sarah Owen album dates back to 2002. The album back cover lists contact info for the Owens:
discogs.com/release/7244278-Ja...zMTA3Njg=
Maybe it’s still current, with the hope that the Owens have copies of the album available.

Dec 27, 2024 - 3:58:09 PM

6957 posts since 9/26/2008

I became curious about who these people are and there is very little out there, unless Jake Owen is the one that seems to be a successful country musician and Sarah is a sourdough queen now. But....after some changes to my search parameters, I found three videos of a fiddler, Sarah Owens, giving some lessons through Madison County (NC) Arts Council. And lo and behold, she teaches that tune saying she only knew of her dad playing it. It does seem to be the Henry Reed tune but I thought I'd post the video here and you all can compare if you'd like. The tune in question is the second half of the video.A to F Reel lesson

Otherwise, she's not the sourdough last and seems nowhere to be found and I still don't know if Jake is the country guy. He was guitar player on the CD mentioned.

Edited by - ChickenMan on 12/27/2024 16:00:17

Dec 28, 2024 - 4:36:59 AM

DougD

USA

12431 posts since 12/2/2007
Online Now

Jake Owen is the son of Malcolm and Vickie Owen, who played in the Fuzzy Mountain string band. I don't know about Sarah, but in that teaching video she actually said she only knew the tune from her "father in law" playing it, which makes sense - wish I could underline "in law" for clarity. I'd guess the contact info linked by DaBru is the best way to contact them.
Yodel-Ay-Hee is/was a "label" originally created by Sam and Joe Herrmann to market the early records of their Critton Hollow Strngband. I recorded the first two, which was a lot of fun. We even took the master tape for the first one to Nashville for the mastering session with Glenn Meadows at Masterfonics. I think it was a pleasant change for him from cutting big pop/country hits, and he was curious how we'd recorded it and made some helpful suggestions. I still enjoy listening to some of those tracks, many of which are on YouTube.
Anyway, Yodel-Ay-Hee became an umbrella label for self produced records by a variety of artists. (The Owen's CD was produced by John Herrmann, Joe's brother, so the connection makes sense). They may have helped expedite things a bit, but I don't think they ever were involved in financing, manufacturing or distribution in the same way that Columbia or even Rounder were. If the Owen's CD is hard to find, its more a reflection of the demise of the CD than a comment on their music.
As I like to say (as of yesterday) "If you ain't streaming, you're just a-dreaming."
An aside - In his notes to "Breakdown in A" Alan notes a possible resemblance to Ralph Stanley's "Clinch Mountain Backstep." I'd previously heard John Salyer's "Lonesome John" mentioned in that context, and I see that looks like the first track on the Owen's CD. Here's Rayna Gellert playing that one: youtu.be/8hDt_FvqHtU?feature=shared
As for me, I have the Henry Reed and John Salyer recordings, as well as the "Backstep," so I think I'm all set.

Edited by - DougD on 12/28/2024 04:41:54

Dec 28, 2024 - 5:30:38 AM
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DougD

USA

12431 posts since 12/2/2007
Online Now

An added bonus (or needless annoyance, depending) but here's the last track from the first album on Yodel-Ay-Hee, "Poor Boy" by the Critton Hollow String Band. Sam Herrmann had a wonderfully delicate and expresive touch on the hammered dulcimer, instead of just banging on it.
At that time the band included Sam's brother Arnold on guitar, and his wife Patti playing bass. So it was two couples, just four people but this track sounds almost like a mini-orchestra, maybe partly because it was recorded in that style.
"Flowers of Antrim" youtu.be/w3oiG83Mn0M?feature=shared

Dec 29, 2024 - 7:52:01 AM

142 posts since 12/26/2021

Bonus, definitely. Sounds more like what I'd expect a Juliard chamber ensemble to sound like than an Appalachian string band. Exquisite!

Dec 29, 2024 - 8:32:30 AM
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4 posts since 12/23/2016

Billy K, That Sarah Owen video teaching what she calls A to F Reel is a near exact match for the tune my friend played. And the chord chart I posted above is a good fit. Thank you.

Dec 31, 2024 - 11:49:01 AM

225 posts since 1/29/2008

I clicked on the link of Sara Owen playing the tune and I kept thinking, 'that really sounds familiar?' I checked my holdings and found a 1972 recording of Malcolm playing it, he just announces this name, nothing else. The more I listened to it, the more familiar it sounded and I dredged up a file of the original tune, a self-penned tune from Surrey County, NC fiddler, Robert Sykes, Robert's Serenade. He recorded it on an out-of-print Heritage LP from the mid-80s, Robert Sykes and The Surrey County Boys (with Verlin Clifton, Paul Brown and Frank Bode). There's also a recording of Rafe Stefanini fiddling it with Molsky playing banjo on that Big Hoedown CD. With any luck, the MP3s are going to be attached with this post?

Dec 31, 2024 - 1:37:35 PM

Loup

Australia

149 posts since 11/24/2012

quote:
Originally posted by bubbaschnell

I clicked on the link of Sara Owen playing the tune and I kept thinking, 'that really sounds familiar?' I checked my holdings and found a 1972 recording of Malcolm playing it, he just announces this name, nothing else. The more I listened to it, the more familiar it sounded and I dredged up a file of the original tune, a self-penned tune from Surrey County, NC fiddler, Robert Sykes, Robert's Serenade. He recorded it on an out-of-print Heritage LP from the mid-80s, Robert Sykes and The Surrey County Boys (with Verlin Clifton, Paul Brown and Frank Bode). There's also a recording of Rafe Stefanini fiddling it with Molsky playing banjo on that Big Hoedown CD. With any luck, the MP3s are going to be attached with this post?


Dec 31, 2024 - 1:39:49 PM

Loup

Australia

149 posts since 11/24/2012

Thanks Bill. Robert's serenade is one tune that I shall get my teeth into.Great tune.

Dec 31, 2024 - 7:18:25 PM

6957 posts since 9/26/2008

quote:
Originally posted by bubbaschnell

I clicked on the link of Sara Owen playing the tune and I kept thinking, 'that really sounds familiar?' I checked my holdings and found a 1972 recording of Malcolm playing it, he just announces this name, nothing else. The more I listened to it, the more familiar it sounded and I dredged up a file of the original tune, a self-penned tune from Surrey County, NC fiddler, Robert Sykes, Robert's Serenade. He recorded it on an out-of-print Heritage LP from the mid-80s, Robert Sykes and The Surrey County Boys (with Verlin Clifton, Paul Brown and Frank Bode). There's also a recording of Rafe Stefanini fiddling it with Molsky playing banjo on that Big Hoedown CD. With any luck, the MP3s are going to be attached with this post?


Is Malcolm related to Sarah?

Dec 31, 2024 - 7:23:35 PM

DougD

USA

12431 posts since 12/2/2007
Online Now

Sarah is Malcolm and Vickie Owen's daughter-in-law (married to their son Jake). (I think).

Edited by - DougD on 12/31/2024 19:24:39

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