I am keen on violin making and last days started deeping into violin varnish topic. Recently, I've found one Ukranian luthier Boris Dmitriev, who found, after 20 years of research, a recipe for varnish that looks exactly like Stradivarius varnish. It's made from so called "liquid marble". Based on it, he creates a very beautiful varnish. He adds pigment crystals in it made as well from this "liquid marble". Well, it's pretty complicated but intriguing. Do you think it's possible to create Straduvarius varnish nowadays? And what it could be as "liquid marble"?.. He treats wood with it before varnishing.
Edited by - Dmitry Volkov on 05/05/2024 14:14:52
This falls well into the category of attempts to discover the “secret of Stradivari.” Over the centuries all kinds of nutty theories have been presented to draw back the curtain and expose the secret that made Strads the greatest violins in the world, one that can be repeated by the discoverer of this mystical knowledge.
The best part of this is that you can read Dmitriev’s ravings on his website.
boris-dmitriev.com/The-Violin-...Monologue
Somehow, given the grandiose and unsubstantiated nature of the language in the “monologue,” it is extremely fitting that the conclusion is that the secret is in growing special crystals (of course, YOU can’t make them very well yourself and neither could Sacconi, but the magnanimous discoverer of the secret the Catholic church worked so hard to bury will send you some of these magic crystals if you want so that you too can enjoy the secret of the inner circle).
I see the maker posted on violinist.com about this discovery. The intervening decade has not led to the widespread dissemination of this earth-shattering discovery. If only the post weren’t archived and you could read the responses in 2014…
A particularly amusing little snippet mentions the famous violist Yuri Bashmet, who has, according to Dmitriev, condemned himself to a disappointing career due to his use of a lowly Testore instead of a Strad. I can only wonder how he justifies the failure of the MacDonald Strad to sell at auction and the less than enthusiastic response of makers and players to Strad violas in comparison to violins or cellos.
If you want to read the best analysis of Stradivari’s varnish, the book by Brandmair and Greiner is the source. You’ll find much different conclusions there and much less attempt to claim an understanding of a varnish that’s been mostly worn off the majority of Strads and has undergone hundreds of years of oxidizing, wear, and retouching.
The idea of using an ingredient to change the refractive index is not a new one. The usual application of this idea is in the surface preparation of ground/pore filler/sealer before varnish is applied. There was a long period of using “water glass” in the ground to get this effect. Roger Hargrave has written on the use of slaked plaster in the ground. There are other arguments for silica grounds. Then there are the arguments for the presence of other things, like ammonia, iron, salts, or other chemical applications.
If you’re new to violin making, I would recommend finding the most reliable sources of information you can to get started. Varnish making is such a difficult pursuit even for those who do it regularly that it’s not something I’d recommend to someone just getting started. The Courtnall/Johnson book is a great resource for getting some good working methods as taught at the Newark violin making school. Roger Hargrave’s website has a lot of great information in it as well. Sacconi’s book does too, although one must keep in mind that he very intentionally titled it “The ‘Secrets’ of Stradivari,” not “The Secrets of Stradivari.”
If you’d like to see some truly impressive varnishing results that look close to Cremonese, the work of Jeff Phillips and Antoine Nedelec are great examples (both are individual and collaborative gold-medal winners at the VSA competitions). The rosinate varnishes that have come into vogue are getting very attractive results and there’s plenty of information on making them available.
There’s still a lot of debate about what exactly Stradivari used for his varnish, and no one has a definitive answer yet. Some research suggests there was a thin layer of protein on the ground layer, possibly casein (a protein from milk), but identifying it has been tricky. It might have reacted with something like calcium oxide (lime), which altered its structure, making it harder to pinpoint.
As for "liquid marble," that’s not a term you’ll typically see in traditional varnish-making, so it could be a modern invention by this luthier. It might be something he’s developed to create that unique look by adding pigments or crystallized materials. While it’s definitely possible for modern luthiers to create varnishes that resemble Stradivari’s, fully recreating the exact method is still really difficult because we don’t know all the details of how he did it.
Here is an article I wrote about varnish:
https://www.rmoretto.com/en/blog/blog-3/the-art-and-science-of-violin-varnish-2
If varnish was so important to the sound, why isn't the inside of the violin varnished too? Saying it protects from moisture, well humidity, last time I checked, is not confined to the outside of the violin. Me, I think it makes the fiddle look nice and maybe adds some protection from the odd knock and extensive abrasion. As pointed out Strads have pretty much lost most of the original varnish. Keep looking guys.
quote:
Originally posted by wrench13If varnish was so important to the sound, why isn't the inside of the violin varnished too? Saying it protects from moisture, well humidity, last time I checked, is not confined to the outside of the violin. Me, I think it makes the fiddle look nice and maybe adds some protection from the odd knock and extensive abrasion. As pointed out Strads have pretty much lost most of the original varnish. Keep looking guys.
Yes, sometimes a thin ground layer like casein or gelatin is used, but it’s more of a sealer than a varnish. It helps protect the wood without affecting the sound too much. Varnishing the inside, though, would dampen the natural vibrations and hurt the sound quality.
On the outside, varnish helps with moisture protection and adds beauty, but it also subtly affects tone. Strads have lost some varnish over time, yet their sound continues to evolve as the wood ages, so it's not just about the varnish!
