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Nov 25, 2022 - 6:40:31 AM
35 posts since 6/20/2022

This is a super difficult scale to play! Frinstance if you are in the key of G, you have to play an A SHARP, meaning your finger has to be on the first "fret" of the A string. In order to play a note on this 'first fret", my hand has to lean back so that it bumps up against the curvy thingy on the back of the pegbox of the fiddle. This curvy projection sure gets in the way & I wonder why it is even there. If I was designing fiddles I would carve that thing flat so my hand could get where it's supposed to go.

I suppose if I was holding the fiddle up with my chin/neck, my hand could just skate around easily...but in my case I am supporting the fiddle with the first knuckle & palm of L. hand.

Nov 25, 2022 - 7:43:37 AM
Players Union Member

Earworm

USA

423 posts since 1/30/2018

I know nothing of the scales your are referring to, but but it seems like an alternate tuning may be helpful in this case - Possibly tune all your string up a 1/2 step? Or maybe tune down a little bit, so you can reach it a little better, but still reach up to that A# if you need that room for a little slide movement for expression. Others will chime in soon. Meanwhile, play a tune.

Nov 25, 2022 - 10:47:04 AM

2091 posts since 4/6/2014
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The Phrygian Mode is usually considered to be a "Spanish" sounding mode. A more "Klezma" sounding scale IMO is the "Double Harmonic" Scale. Here it is in a single octave of D.


Nov 25, 2022 - 10:53:56 AM

RichJ

USA

801 posts since 8/6/2013

Even though I'm a big fan of cross tuning Bb/A# are the same note and there are lots of fiddle tunes in the key of F major which require that note. It really shouldn't be impossible to achieve in standard tuning. That said I often tune one of my fiddles to FCFC which makes playing in F pretty easy. You could try that as well.

Ooops... forgot to mention for some music purists Bb and A# are not EXACTLY the same, but for most of us back porch fiddlers they're close enough. lol

Edited by - RichJ on 11/25/2022 10:58:11

Nov 25, 2022 - 11:20:28 AM

2091 posts since 4/6/2014
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If you are in the "KEY" of G Major, the "Phrygian" mode of G Major starts and ends on the 3rd degree,(or note), of the G Major Scale. This is the note B Natural.

This gives you the 3rd "MODE" of the G Major scale, (Which is also known as G Ionian "MODE" if you are thinking modally.)

B,C,D,E,F#,G,A,B


Nov 25, 2022 - 12:27:44 PM
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2157 posts since 12/11/2008

Try playing a major scale, but instead of starting at the Do, start playing at the other notes in the scale like Re or Mi. No matter what names these various "modes" are given, playing them will open up a veritable universe of flavorful, tune-worthy possibilities.

Nov 25, 2022 - 1:27:10 PM

2091 posts since 4/6/2014
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quote:
Originally posted by Lonesome Fiddler

Try playing a major scale, but instead of starting at the Do, start playing at the other notes in the scale like Re or Mi. No matter what names these various "modes" are given, playing them will open up a veritable universe of flavorful, tune-worthy possibilities.


But it is nice to know the names of the 7 modes so you can talk to other folk about them. After all there are only 7 of them in a major scale.

Ionian, Dorian,Phrygian,Lydian,Mixolydian, Aolian, And Locrian....Not too difficult imo. or just call em 1st,2nd,3rd,4th,5th, 6th, and 7th modes of the Major scale? At least folk would be singing from the same widely accepted hymn sheet.

And there is more to them than just "The Major scale starting at different degrees of the Major scale" once you start paring them down to pentatonics and adding blue notes, or altering them in any other way.

Nov 25, 2022 - 1:58:02 PM

3223 posts since 9/13/2009

G Phrygian is same as Eb major. 

Like other flat keys, not the easiest for beginners. 

In order to play a note on this 'first fret", my hand has to lean back so that it bumps up against the curvy thingy on the back of the pegbox of the fiddle. 

in my case I am supporting the fiddle with the first knuckle & palm of L

 If I was designing fiddles I would carve that thing flat so my hand could get where it's supposed to go.

Perhaps you know more about it than master violin makers over last hundreds of years? laugh 

Or perhaps, your hand is probably not positioned in right place. Sounds like too far back. As well, your hold is likely contributing to the issue. 

 

Nov 26, 2022 - 3:33:31 PM
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2399 posts since 8/23/2008

..but in my case I am supporting the fiddle with the first knuckle & palm of L. hand.

It seems by this description, that you are holding the fiddle with the "pancake hand position", and I'm not sure how you could be touching that 'curvy thingy'. When the hand is held in a straight line from the forearm each finger is much more able to play at least two notes while keeping the hand in the same position to play any of those notes. So, while maintaining a good left hand shape, and without any alteration of this shape; in first position the first finger can play Bb and B, second finger C and C#, third finger D and D#, fourth finger E and F. 

  

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