Can anybody tell me if this guy is throwing in some Hokum bowing here? There's one example at 2:10 and then a few other places as well. Or is it just some fast cross string playing?
youtube.com/watch?v=1F6D0vjJji...t_radio=1
I thought those players were all him...lol...the mando pre=haircut version and then the guitar and fiddle post-haircut...didn't notice the woman on bass until later...lol...so I guess that wasn't all him.
Anyway, I saw fancy bowing but it didn't look like actual hokum shuffles to me...just my opinion...the second one where he gets really jazzy had similar rhythm as hokum but it didn't involve the same bow strokes as hokum to get there. At least in my opinion. I'm sure others will jump in who can tell you better, since anything about bowing draws all fiddlers like a crow hollerin' in the woods...lol. Who can resist a bowing thread.
No.
It was like the first shuffle without the entire bowing statement> I rather liked how it was used to emphasize the next passage. The flat picker is Robert Bolin, a most excellent fiddler in his own right, and the bassist is Wil Maring. R/
Edited by - UsuallyPickin on 10/25/2022 06:11:43
This is hokum shuffle at about 45 seconds in,
Ok, thanks, so what exactly is he doing there at 2:10. I love that effect and have heard it other places too. I always assumed that I was hearing hokum bowing, but now that I'm actually learning hokum bowing, I was thinking, "Wait, I don't think that's exactly what I'm learning."
Hear the difference in the same song/tune:
Here's Ragtime Annie, (wait for the 3rd round)
youtu.be/YoiS8pj9o6Y
doryman I don't think that's hokum, he's just alternating notes. Hokum bowing is usually 1-2 on one string and then one on the higher string like the Back up and Push example. I think this guy is just doing 1 on string, then 1 on a second string.
quote:
Originally posted by farmerjonesHear the difference in the same song/tune:
Here's Ragtime Annie, (wait for the 3rd round)
youtu.be/YoiS8pj9o6Y
Thanks, so the that's hokum at around the 2:01? And the stuff before was just fast string crossing? I'm sorry for being so dense, it's new to me a some of that fast stuff is just a blur. Also, if I could play like that, I'd quit my day job!
What you were talking about in the clip you posted was indeed "fast/fancy string crossing" - a kind of descending run going back and forth between two strings that is written into or can be added to many, many, many tunes; e.g., in Speed the Plough, it's essential to the second turn.
quote:
Originally posted by dorymanquote:
Originally posted by farmerjonesHear the difference in the same song/tune:
Here's Ragtime Annie, (wait for the 3rd round)
youtu.be/YoiS8pj9o6YThanks, so the that's hokum at around the 2:01? And the stuff before was just fast string crossing? I'm sorry for being so dense, it's new to me a some of that fast stuff is just a blur. Also, if I could play like that, I'd quit my day job!
You are correct. That little bit there is the double shuffle hokum. IF you want to learn it, there are numerous lessons on YT.
There's a reason it's referred to as hokum..
Edited by - ChickenMan on 10/25/2022 11:37:14
quote:
Originally posted by Old ScratchWhat you were talking about in the clip you posted was indeed "fast/fancy string crossing" - a kind of descending run going back and forth between two strings that is written into or can be added to many, many, many tunes; e.g., in Speed the Plough, it's essential to the second turn.
Thanks, I really have to learn to do that, it's one of my favorite "fiddle tricks."
quote:
Originally posted by ChickenManquote:
Originally posted by dorymanquote:
Originally posted by farmerjonesHear the difference in the same song/tune:
Here's Ragtime Annie, (wait for the 3rd round)
youtu.be/YoiS8pj9o6YThanks, so the that's hokum at around the 2:01? And the stuff before was just fast string crossing? I'm sorry for being so dense, it's new to me a some of that fast stuff is just a blur. Also, if I could play like that, I'd quit my day job!
You are correct. That little bit there is the double shuffle hokum. IF you want to learn it, there are numerous lessons on YT.
There's a reason it's referred to as hokum..
Yes, I understand the reference. I do wonder who gets to decide which fiddle tricks are legit and which are gimmicks. I have some ideas about that, so I'd like to be the decider if at all possible.
Thanks ChickenMan! I've been on the road. (Or in the field)
Many a tune you can hear versions where a player is "wearing it out." He going through his memory bank of licks. There's the Buddy part, and the Seckler part, and the Floparino part, and don't forget the Benny part. Michael Cleveland can wear a tune out. You'll hear all that but more. Very organic. Vince Gil has a video where he's wearing out Oklahoma Boarderline, on guitar. Art Tatum was a piano player. Tell him to play Blue Skies, and he'd play it for an hour. You'd never hear an invention repeated. The concept comes from Jazz improvisation, but any type of music or musician can adopt it.
Edited by - farmerjones on 10/25/2022 13:45:59
The example at 2:10 is 'single stroke fast string crossing'. He does throw in a '2-1 double shuffle' here and there', which is evident by the syncopation of the higher string part, but he never actually completes a full pattern.
Patti Kosturuk does that here, mixing up the hokum bowing with that fast descending string-crossing thing, at 1:29 (she might do it earlier somewhere, too): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dperkjNwChU
Edited by - Old Scratch on 10/25/2022 17:56:25
Patti is playing it all over the place, and it is how the tune goes. But in the original vid that guy is throwing it into his improv.....
Well, if we're talking about the same thing, yes and no: the hokum bowing is basic to the tune, but that fast descending string-crossing, of 4 or 8 notes, depending how you're counting it (Bb, A, G, F, on the E string, to Bb on the A string), is not - you won't hear it in Earl Mitton's recording of it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBpE8MrqQL4 ... so how much Patti is improvising and how much she is playing the tune as she learned it, I don't know.
I was only concerned with the 'hokum/double shuffle'. In the OP vid that guy is improvising and using the double shuffle in snippets.
I am pretty sure Patti is not improvising but playing variations in Earl Mitten's Breakdown.
Gotcha.
quote:
Originally posted by RobBobThis is hokum shuffle at about 45 seconds in,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XXKM4aYslA
Hmm, that guy is pretty good. Heh Heh.
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