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Aug 1, 2021 - 8:48:24 PM
1464 posts since 7/26/2015

Which one of these six tunes do you think I play the best?

"Sally Goodin", "Grey Eagle", "Tom and Jerry", "Billy in the Lowground", and "Leather Britches"
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"Forked Deer"
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Edited by - soppinthegravy on 08/01/2021 20:49:04

Aug 2, 2021 - 12:06:44 AM

2291 posts since 8/23/2008

"Forked Deer" This sounds like a different player than the first file.
The articulation is much clearer, better intonation and steady rhythm.
I think you know this tune really well.

Aug 2, 2021 - 4:07:41 AM
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5370 posts since 9/26/2008

"Forked Deer" hands down.

Aug 2, 2021 - 6:20:22 AM

9340 posts since 3/19/2009

Yes, Forked Deer, but you might want to develop a relationship with a metronome.. It would help on all of your tunes..I say this kindly, because I struggled (Still do) with timing and my metronome is a Godsend!!!

Aug 2, 2021 - 9:19:03 PM

1464 posts since 7/26/2015

Thanks. I've heard it all my life, but I can never make up my mind how to play it I worry a lot about my intonation on that tune. I put a lick in the 2nd bar B part that uses both G natural and G sharp on the D string, and I worry that I don't distinguish between them well enough and/or that the G natural sounds like a mistake. I use that same lick a lot in "Grey Eagle". I'm not sure where I picked it up. EGF#G#. All 16th notes, I think.
quote:
Originally posted by buckhenry

"Forked Deer" This sounds like a different player than the first file.
The articulation is much clearer, better intonation and steady rhythm.
I think you know this tune really well.


Edited by - soppinthegravy on 08/02/2021 21:24:52

Aug 5, 2021 - 2:38:22 PM

1464 posts since 7/26/2015

How slow should I set it to start with? I think mine only goes down to about 40BPM, but the guitar accompaniment on Strum Machine can go all the way down to 10 BPM.  If we're talking about breakdowns/hoedowns/reels, I tend to think of the range between 100BPM and 130BPM as "normal" speed. 130BPM and above as "fast", and 100BPM and below as "slow".  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afhSDK5DJqA  quote:

Originally posted by TuneWeaver

Yes, Forked Deer, but you might want to develop a relationship with a metronome.. It would help on all of your tunes..I say this kindly, because I struggled (Still do) with timing and my metronome is a Godsend!!!


Edited by - soppinthegravy on 08/05/2021 14:47:40

Aug 5, 2021 - 2:44:09 PM
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9340 posts since 3/19/2009

quote:
Originally posted by soppinthegravy
How slow should I set it to start with? I think mine only goes down to about 40BPM, but the guitar accomaniment on Strum Machine can go all the way down to 10 BPM. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afhSDK5DJqAquote:

Originally posted by TuneWeaver

Yes, Forked Deer, but you might want to develop a relationship with a metronome.. It would help on all of your tunes..I say this kindly, because I struggled (Still do) with timing and my metronome is a Godsend!!!


 


play a tune, tap your foot...That foot tap speed  is the speed  at which you set your metronome.. Typically 100pbm  is  a good place for playing OT tunes.. Dance speed is about 115 bpm...(it is all debatable)..Play along as if you are playing along with a solid musicians foot tap..!!! Works for me.. 

Pick Someone ELSE playing an OT tune.. Tap along with the music.. THAT is the speed to set your metronome to...  What I'll do is play a tune at 100 bpm, and when I've 'got' it at that speed, I'll either slow it down by 5 bpm, or speed it up by 5 bpm.. I want to be able to play SOLIDLY at any reasonable speed..  This reminds me of a topic I made years ago about timing.. Watch for it..

Edited by - TuneWeaver on 08/05/2021 14:51:12

Aug 5, 2021 - 2:56:50 PM

1464 posts since 7/26/2015

Thanks. Here's an article I stumbled upon a while ago. https://clawdan.com/articles/the-need-for-speed/
quote:
Originally posted by TuneWeaver
quote:
Originally posted by soppinthegravy
How slow should I set it to start with? I think mine only goes down to about 40BPM, but the guitar accomaniment on Strum Machine can go all the way down to 10 BPM. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afhSDK5DJqAquote:

Originally posted by TuneWeaver

Yes, Forked Deer, but you might want to develop a relationship with a metronome.. It would help on all of your tunes..I say this kindly, because I struggled (Still do) with timing and my metronome is a Godsend!!!


 


play a tune, tap your foot...That foot tap speed  is the speed  at which you set your metronome.. Typically 100pbm  is  a good place for playing OT tunes.. Dance speed is about 115 bpm...(it is all debatable)..Play along as if you are playing along with a solid musicians foot tap..!!! Works for me.. 


Aug 5, 2021 - 4:58:16 PM
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9340 posts since 3/19/2009

quote:
Originally posted by soppinthegravy
Thanks. Here's an article I stumbled upon a while ago. https://clawdan.com/articles/the-need-for-speed/
quote:
Originally posted by TuneWeaver
quote:
Originally posted by soppinthegravy
How slow should I set it to start with? I think mine only goes down to about 40BPM, but the guitar accomaniment on Strum Machine can go all the way down to 10 BPM. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afhSDK5DJqAquote:

Originally posted by TuneWeaver

Yes, Forked Deer, but you might want to develop a relationship with a metronome.. It would help on all of your tunes..I say this kindly, because I struggled (Still do) with timing and my metronome is a Godsend!!!


 


play a tune, tap your foot...That foot tap speed  is the speed  at which you set your metronome.. Typically 100pbm  is  a good place for playing OT tunes.. Dance speed is about 115 bpm...(it is all debatable)..Play along as if you are playing along with a solid musicians foot tap..!!! Works for me.. 


 

 

It really isn't a question of how fast or how slow.. it is a question of Keeping the same pace you start with.. Don't speed up in a certain measure, don't slow down in a hard part... KEEP the pace..A musician may think that they are doing that but if put to the test of a metronome.. well, it can be humbling.. Usually the people trying to tap their foot OUR playing will be the first to notice that suddenly the tune has sped up or slowed down.. The musician may THINK they haven't changed speed but they Have ..!!

Edited by - TuneWeaver on 08/05/2021 16:58:38

Aug 5, 2021 - 5:30:42 PM

1464 posts since 7/26/2015

One of my mentors argues that contestants shouldn't be allowed to play solo, because it's harder to tell if they've broken time than if there is a guitar, bass, or banjo behind them giving everybody a clear reference for where the beats are.
quote:
Originally posted by TuneWeaver
quote:
Originally posted by soppinthegravy
Thanks. Here's an article I stumbled upon a while ago. https://clawdan.com/articles/the-need-for-speed/
quote:
Originally posted by TuneWeaver
quote:
Originally posted by soppinthegravy
How slow should I set it to start with? I think mine only goes down to about 40BPM, but the guitar accomaniment on Strum Machine can go all the way down to 10 BPM. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afhSDK5DJqAquote:

Originally posted by TuneWeaver

Yes, Forked Deer, but you might want to develop a relationship with a metronome.. It would help on all of your tunes..I say this kindly, because I struggled (Still do) with timing and my metronome is a Godsend!!!


 


play a tune, tap your foot...That foot tap speed  is the speed  at which you set your metronome.. Typically 100pbm  is  a good place for playing OT tunes.. Dance speed is about 115 bpm...(it is all debatable)..Play along as if you are playing along with a solid musicians foot tap..!!! Works for me.. 


 

 

It really isn't a question of how fast or how slow.. it is a question of Keeping the same pace you start with.. Don't speed up in a certain measure, don't slow down in a hard part... KEEP the pace..A musician may think that they are doing that but if put to the test of a metronome.. well, it can be humbling.. Usually the people trying to tap their foot OUR playing will be the first to notice that suddenly the tune has sped up or slowed down.. The musician may THINK they haven't changed speed but they Have ..!!

 


Aug 5, 2021 - 5:59:43 PM
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DougD

USA

10264 posts since 12/2/2007

That seems silly to me. If I'm judging a contest (infrequently) I can certainly tell if someone is keeping good time. And how do you know the guitar, bass or banjo are keeping the beat well?
BTW, I don't think music needs to be played like a metronome with an absolutely strict unvarying beat. It needs to ebb and flow a little for expression. That's not the same as not being able to keep time though.

Aug 5, 2021 - 7:07:17 PM

9340 posts since 3/19/2009

DO you mean that the contestant SHOULD have to play solo to prove good timing? or should NOT play solo.. I'm a little confused about what your mentor means..
quote:
Originally posted by soppinthegravy
One of my mentors argues that contestants shouldn't be allowed to play solo, because it's harder to tell if they've broken time than if there is a guitar, bass, or banjo behind them giving everybody a clear reference for where the beats are.
quote:
Originally posted by TuneWeaver
quote:
Originally posted by soppinthegravy
Thanks. Here's an article I stumbled upon a while ago. https://clawdan.com/articles/the-need-for-speed/
quote:
Originally posted by TuneWeaver
quote:
Originally posted by soppinthegravy
How slow should I set it to start with? I think mine only goes down to about 40BPM, but the guitar accomaniment on Strum Machine can go all the way down to 10 BPM. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afhSDK5DJqAquote:

Originally posted by TuneWeaver

Yes, Forked Deer, but you might want to develop a relationship with a metronome.. It would help on all of your tunes..I say this kindly, because I struggled (Still do) with timing and my metronome is a Godsend!!!


 


play a tune, tap your foot...That foot tap speed  is the speed  at which you set your metronome.. Typically 100pbm  is  a good place for playing OT tunes.. Dance speed is about 115 bpm...(it is all debatable)..Play along as if you are playing along with a solid musicians foot tap..!!! Works for me.. 


 

 

It really isn't a question of how fast or how slow.. it is a question of Keeping the same pace you start with.. Don't speed up in a certain measure, don't slow down in a hard part... KEEP the pace..A musician may think that they are doing that but if put to the test of a metronome.. well, it can be humbling.. Usually the people trying to tap their foot OUR playing will be the first to notice that suddenly the tune has sped up or slowed down.. The musician may THINK they haven't changed speed but they Have ..!!

 


 


Aug 5, 2021 - 9:51:21 PM

1464 posts since 7/26/2015

He says they should be required to have an accompanist. He might consider playing a tune crooked breaking time. I don't know. I wonder what requiring contest fiddlers to have a five-string banjo backing them on all tunes would do to the typical contest framework. I'd be interested to see that. Of course, my being a banjo picker might have something to do with it. I imagine banning tenor guitars might shake things up a bit, too. LOL!
quote:
Originally posted by TuneWeaver
DO you mean that the contestant SHOULD have to play solo to prove good timing? or should NOT play solo.. I'm a little confused about what your mentor means..
quote:
Originally posted by soppinthegravy
One of my mentors argues that contestants shouldn't be allowed to play solo, because it's harder to tell if they've broken time than if there is a guitar, bass, or banjo behind them giving everybody a clear reference for where the beats are.
quote:
Originally posted by TuneWeaver
quote:
Originally posted by soppinthegravy
Thanks. Here's an article I stumbled upon a while ago. https://clawdan.com/articles/the-need-for-speed/
quote:
Originally posted by TuneWeaver
quote:
Originally posted by soppinthegravy
How slow should I set it to start with? I think mine only goes down to about 40BPM, but the guitar accomaniment on Strum Machine can go all the way down to 10 BPM. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afhSDK5DJqAquote:

Originally posted by TuneWeaver

Yes, Forked Deer, but you might want to develop a relationship with a metronome.. It would help on all of your tunes..I say this kindly, because I struggled (Still do) with timing and my metronome is a Godsend!!!


 


play a tune, tap your foot...That foot tap speed  is the speed  at which you set your metronome.. Typically 100pbm  is  a good place for playing OT tunes.. Dance speed is about 115 bpm...(it is all debatable)..Play along as if you are playing along with a solid musicians foot tap..!!! Works for me.. 


 

 

It really isn't a question of how fast or how slow.. it is a question of Keeping the same pace you start with.. Don't speed up in a certain measure, don't slow down in a hard part... KEEP the pace..A musician may think that they are doing that but if put to the test of a metronome.. well, it can be humbling.. Usually the people trying to tap their foot OUR playing will be the first to notice that suddenly the tune has sped up or slowed down.. The musician may THINK they haven't changed speed but they Have ..!!

 


 


 


Aug 5, 2021 - 10:01:46 PM

1464 posts since 7/26/2015

I don't disagree. I've heard of sillier rules. Believe it or not, one of the contest organizers years ago forced the dance bands to play to a metronome.
quote:
Originally posted by DougD

That seems silly to me. If I'm judging a contest (infrequently) I can certainly tell if someone is keeping good time. And how do you know the guitar, bass or banjo are keeping the beat well?
BTW, I don't think music needs to be played like a metronome with an absolutely strict unvarying beat. It needs to ebb and flow a little for expression. That's not the same as not being able to keep time though.


Aug 6, 2021 - 6:00:25 AM
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5370 posts since 9/26/2008

To me, if there isn't an accompanist, you can hear their timing better. Sounds to me like the rule forcing a metronome is a joke. How loud would they make the metronome? Who's listening to it? What bands are that lock step in time?

Aug 6, 2021 - 6:11:26 AM

2761 posts since 9/13/2009

quote:
Originally posted by DougD

That seems silly to me. If I'm judging a contest (infrequently) I can certainly tell if someone is keeping good time. And how do you know the guitar, bass or banjo are keeping the beat well?
BTW, I don't think music needs to be played like a metronome with an absolutely strict unvarying beat. It needs to ebb and flow a little for expression. That's not the same as not being able to keep time though.


I can't imagine a qualified judge not being able to understand where the beat is, or what feels like steady time, without some other reference?*

Non-musicians, dancers, and even some banjo player can figure it out.cheeky

Might be related to that there is a modern idea about "timing"... and quantitize; not only that the metronome bpm should never change; but where notes land and spaced. The idea is should be quantitized to  the grid, that it's "better".  The grid is in reference to modern digital recording... visual grid of spacing; and using the software that can align notes to land and be perfectly spaced along the step grid. (Studio One can do this). Their idea of perfect timing, and sounds better. Subjective, but notice often folks rely on using their eyes, rather than listening to how it actually rhythmically feels.

-------

*of course poor playing, timing, phrasing, beat accent, might be helped sound better or make sense by solid accompaniment. But if that is needed, is that really sign of a good fiddling?

Edited by - alaskafiddler on 08/06/2021 06:16:28

Aug 6, 2021 - 10:50:43 AM
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1464 posts since 7/26/2015

It really happened. No joke. The musicians were outraged.
quote:
Originally posted by ChickenMan

To me, if there isn't an accompanist, you can hear their timing better. Sounds to me like the rule forcing a metronome is a joke. How loud would they make the metronome? Who's listening to it? What bands are that lock step in time?


Aug 6, 2021 - 11:19:21 AM

5370 posts since 9/26/2008

I would have been too!

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