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Woe is me.. Sometimes you just can't win

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Mar 9, 2018 - 1:21:28 PM
6768 posts since 3/19/2009

I'm just going to VENT here a little....OK, so I wanted to host a "KEY OF C" jam.. because C tunes don't get played often at our regular jams.. One guy won't come because he doesn't like to be in C all evening, plus he doesn't like our other jams because we stay in the same key for up to two hours at a time. Another guy doesn't want to come because he doesn't know any C tunes and doesn't want to listen to them for two hours.
Ten musicians on stage at the contra dance open mic.. . Varied skills and instruments. I was the host and tried to choose tunes that I thought most of the people would know, knowing that not everyone would know every tune.. Complaints... "Why are you picking tune that I don't know?"...."you don't play loud enough"... "you play too loud""...."That is not the speed I usually play it".... "Your tunes are too crooked"......."Why do they only have two chords?"............."The tunes are too basic" "the tunes are too complex"....."Play the next tune faster than you did the first but slower than you did the second"  ...."That is not the version I usually play". ''When I play with other people we all, always play the tunes until we are tight""No, you can't come to our jam.. it is just the 4 of us and no newcomers are allowed"...
"I play out several nights a week, no I can't tell you where.." yada, yada, yada.
Thanks. I feel better now.
.......

Edited by - TuneWeaver on 03/09/2018 13:30:39

Mar 9, 2018 - 1:41:13 PM
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fujers

USA

5237 posts since 2/14/2008

Well Lee, Playing in C is no different than playing in G but playing in C you have a lot more you can play to the upside..meaning you can play more notes than in G..just incase you want to know. But perhaps you didn't ask that question...I'll chrawl back under my rock now.Jerry

Mar 9, 2018 - 3:02:51 PM
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5651 posts since 8/7/2009

quote:
Originally posted by fujers

Well Lee, Playing in C is no different than playing in G but playing in C you have a lot more you can play to the upside..meaning you can play more notes than in G..just incase you want to know. But perhaps you didn't ask that question...I'll chrawl back under my rock now.Jerry


Jerry - for the rest of the world "C" is a fairly common key to play tunes / songs in, but in the old time fiddle world - it's not as common as you might think. That's not to say it's never done, or there aren't any tunes in C, but I can't remember the last time I played an old time fiddle tune in C. I don't remember ever trying to learn one. Mainly because - it's not as common as you might think. I would be learning tunes I may never get a chance to play. 

BUT, I do remember - not too long ago - we did play a C tune in the key of D...  smiley

I'm afraid I would disappoint you too Lee. Not saying I wouldn't try, but you would probably still be disappointed.  wink I don't think me attempting to play 2 hours of tunes I probably don't know or may never have never heard (much less played) before, in a key I'm not familiar with, in a tuning I'm not very proficient in, would make anyone happy. blush

But...  "I feel your pain."  laugh

Mar 9, 2018 - 3:08:10 PM
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6768 posts since 3/19/2009

Fortunately for me I DO have a couple of fiddling friends who at Battleground or Clifftop will join me for two hours of C tunes... I can be done...It is only for the brave though..!!

Mar 9, 2018 - 3:11:40 PM
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1419 posts since 8/27/2008

I like C tunes well enough, but I would've complained about ONLY playing C tunes all night. Why do you do that?

Mar 9, 2018 - 3:22:37 PM
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139 posts since 1/27/2018

I know maybe a dozen American C tunes. Lets see:
Hell Broke Loose in Georgia, That’s My Rabbit..., Ten Cent Cotton, Billy in the Low Ground, Boston Boy, Ashland Breakdown, Birdie, Roxanna Waltz, White Rose Waltz, Stone’s Rag, East Tennessee Blues, Back Up and Push, The Fun’s All Over.
If I played each tune for ten minutes that would get me through 2 hours. I don’t think I’ve ever met anyone that knows enough C tunes for a 2 hour jam but I’m sure they exist in limited numbers.

Mar 9, 2018 - 3:58:05 PM
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76 posts since 8/30/2017

Farewell Trion is a pretty fun one in C. It's been getting more popular lately it seems. As is East Tennessee Blues. Depending on the genre of the jam and the region, Billy in the Lowrground, Grey Eagle and Denver Belle can be relatively common C tunes. Just my experience :)

Edited by - PrairieFiddler on 03/09/2018 16:02:34

Mar 9, 2018 - 4:45:52 PM

6768 posts since 3/19/2009

quote:
Originally posted by abinigia

I like C tunes well enough, but I would've complained about ONLY playing C tunes all night. Why do you do that?


I'll bet you have no trouble playing G or D tunes for two hours????  We have done C jams in the past... TWO HOURS... that is Not any longer than we'd stay in any other key.. My list of C tunes is about 50 tunes and some friends have their own list...Doing a C jam is just to give those tunes a chance considering that most jams play Not even One C tune in a month.... It amounts to just a small percentage of the total tunes played around here.. Those of us who DO like to play in C have no problem with it....

Edited by - TuneWeaver on 03/09/2018 16:47:40

Mar 10, 2018 - 4:02:41 AM
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Players Union Member

carlb

USA

2075 posts since 2/2/2008

The key of C is the official key of the Thornbury Ramblers. Here's my greater then 10 list (Favorites change over time).
Altamont
Billy in the Lowground
Birdie
Cherokee Polka
Cherry River Rag
Cranberry Rock
Darktown Strutters Ball
Done Gone
East Tennessee Blues
Fourteen Days Through Georgia
Good Bye Liza Jane (Eddie Fox, from 19th century sheet music & Ira Ford's book)
Greenback Dollar Bill
Hale’s Rag
Hell Broke Loose in Georgia
Hell Up Coal Hollow (Fun’s All Over)
Honey Suckle
Horseshoe Bend
I Don't Love Nobody
Katy Did
Last Shot Got Him
L&N Rag
Little Rose (A min - C)
Maysville
Meeting in the Air
Mississippi Breakdown
Monkey in the Dog Cart
New Money
Old Joe
Paddy Won't You Drink Some Cider (also D)
Peacock Rag (also D)
Pike's Peak
Ragged But Right
Rocky Pallet
Rose Division
Sand Mtn Drag
Saturday Night Breakdown
Shelvin' Rock (Henry Reed)
Stone's Rag
Stone Mountain Wobble
That’s My Rabbit, My Dog Caught It
Tennessee Mountain Fox Chase
Texas Gals
Wagoner

Mar 10, 2018 - 5:02:40 AM

6768 posts since 3/19/2009

quote:
Originally posted by carlb

The key of C is the official key of the Thornbury Ramblers. Here's my greater then 10 list (Favorites change over time).
Altamont
Billy in the Lowground
Birdie
Cherokee Polka
Cherry River Rag
Cranberry Rock
Darktown Strutters Ball
Done Gone
East Tennessee Blues
Fourteen Days Through Georgia
Good Bye Liza Jane (Eddie Fox, from 19th century sheet music & Ira Ford's book)
Greenback Dollar Bill
Hale’s Rag
Hell Broke Loose in Georgia
Hell Up Coal Hollow (Fun’s All Over)
Honey Suckle
Horseshoe Bend
I Don't Love Nobody
Katy Did
Last Shot Got Him
L&N Rag
Little Rose (A min - C)
Maysville
Meeting in the Air
Mississippi Breakdown
Monkey in the Dog Cart
New Money
Old Joe
Paddy Won't You Drink Some Cider (also D)
Peacock Rag (also D)
Pike's Peak
Ragged But Right
Rocky Pallet
Rose Division
Sand Mtn Drag
Saturday Night Breakdown
Shelvin' Rock (Henry Reed)
Stone's Rag
Stone Mountain Wobble
That’s My Rabbit, My Dog Caught It
Tennessee Mountain Fox Chase
Texas Gals
Wagoner


Wonderful list, Carl.. I know almost every one of those tunes. Too bad we can't get together sometime... BTW if readers will go back to the OP and read it again they will see that my WOE IS ME had a lot to do with complaints NOT related to C jams...(looking for sympathy)....

Mar 10, 2018 - 5:13:50 AM

3840 posts since 9/26/2008

We’re you playing for dancers or was this just a jam?

Mar 10, 2018 - 5:26:12 AM
Players Union Member

carlb

USA

2075 posts since 2/2/2008

quote:
Originally posted by ChickenMan

We’re you playing for dancers or was this just a jam?


Both though some of the tunes don't work for dances.

Mar 10, 2018 - 5:28:53 AM

3840 posts since 9/26/2008

quote:
Originally posted by TuneWeaver
quote:
Originally posted 

I like C tunes well enough, but I would've complained about ONLY playing C tunes all night. Why do you do that?


I'll bet you have no trouble playing G or D tunes for two hours????  We have done C jams in the past... TWO HOURS... that is Not any longer than we'd stay in any other key.. My list of C tunes is about 50 tunes and some friends have their own list...Doing a C jam is just to give those tunes a chance considering that most jams play Not even One C tune in a month.... It amounts to just a small percentage of the total tunes played around here.. Those of us who DO like to play in C have no problem with it....


Jams vary from region to region.  Believe or not, around here, I’ve only jammed with one person who stays in one key for long stretches, and he was my first and only (official) teacher. I would add that most tunes played last no longer than 3 minutes on average and key changes are as often as every tune sometimes. A banjo player is rare, and a clawhammer player is even rarer. C tunes are not uncommon though. The idea of only playing in one key for more than a handful of tunes is unheard of really, even the bluegrass pickers want a change after three or four A tunes/songs in a row.  Thank goodness for dances; If it weren’t for playing for them, I doubt I would have the stamina to hang at Clifftop.

Mar 10, 2018 - 5:29:09 AM
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10171 posts since 9/23/2009

I woulda showed up, but with my fiddle tuned so as to be fingering in D instead of C...lol.

Mar 10, 2018 - 5:30:33 AM
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6768 posts since 3/19/2009

quote:
Originally posted by ChickenMan

We’re you playing for dancers or was this just a jam?


it was a mixed post about General complaints.  Id never get away with playing a C tune at opea mic night

Mar 10, 2018 - 5:32:06 AM

3840 posts since 9/26/2008

quote:
Originally posted by carlb
quote:
Originally posted by ChickenMan

We’re you playing for dancers or was this just a jam?


Both though some of the tunes don't work for dances.


I was referring to Lee’s event smiley 

aside: I’m curious at to whether I’ll get a notification about being tagged since my quote contains Carl’s tagged  quote.

Mar 10, 2018 - 5:35:07 AM
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3840 posts since 9/26/2008

I was curious because tempo complaints can be valid where dancing is concerned and sometimes the band just isn’t paying attention.

Frankly, I’m jealous of your jam opportunities, complaints or no complaints.

Mar 10, 2018 - 5:48:47 AM

3840 posts since 9/26/2008

BTW “it’s just the four of us” sounds like band practice to me.
My biggest gripe in a jam is tuning and playing in tune. Imagine playing where one person in the group cannot seem to play (even the tunes he calls) in tune. I was next to him at my last jam and observed his left hand. I’m pretty sure he is oblivious to the fact that the G natural on the E string even exists, as no matter the key he fingers it as sharp. Oh the discord! I mean, I’ve noticed the G note is often a little fluid from one player to the next, but add a note that is clearly sharp on top of it all.... I shudder at the thought.

Mar 10, 2018 - 5:49:19 AM
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6768 posts since 3/19/2009

quote:
Originally posted by ChickenMan

I was curious because tempo complaints can be valid where dancing is concerned and sometimes the band just isn’t paying attention.

Frankly, I’m jealous of your jam opportunities, complaints or no complaints.


The tempo complaint was valid because that night there were more beginners dancing than there were experienced dancers.  The caller ask us to play slowly for the first dance..Then he wanted the second, simpler dance to be played fast.. A Different caller wanted the intermediate speed.  

Numerous jam opportunities can be  a problem.. Too many and people start to get critical, form cliques and feel that they can complain..I complain also... Some regular jams are so large and noisy that I just don't go anymore.  I realize that a lot of Hangout members don't have many jam opportunities and would relish going to some around here.....for a while...then, they would complain also...So many musicians just don't LISTEN.   They try to play along LOUDLY with a tune that they haven't even listened to one time through.  Ironically, the biggest complainers (still my FRIENDS, really) never host jams.. Here I am, COMPLAINING.. When I was a beginner, I'd go to ANY jam and NEVER complain because I actually had real live people to play with..Now I'm more discriminating musically.. Again, ALL of these people are my friends and we complain to each other about each other  often...Friends can do that..

Edited by - TuneWeaver on 03/10/2018 05:52:04

Mar 10, 2018 - 6:01:03 AM
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6768 posts since 3/19/2009

quote:
Originally posted by ChickenMan

BTW “it’s just the four of us” sounds like band practice to me.
My biggest gripe in a jam is tuning and playing in tune. Imagine playing where one person in the group cannot seem to play (even the tunes he calls) in tune. I was next to him at my last jam and observed his left hand. I’m pretty sure he is oblivious to the fact that the G natural on the E string even exists, as no matter the key he fingers it as sharp. Oh the discord! I mean, I’ve noticed the G note is often a little fluid from one player to the next, but add a note that is clearly sharp on top of it all.... I shudder at the thought.

I CAN RELATE...BTW, about 1/2 of the jams I go to are the ones I HOST....Sometimes one just has to make it happen, himself..!!!

Edited by - TuneWeaver on 03/10/2018 06:07:58

Mar 10, 2018 - 7:27:40 PM
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116 posts since 6/23/2007

I could play C tunes all night....
Hey Carl, just gotta give Wagoner a thumbs up. I play the Salyer version.

Mar 11, 2018 - 10:39:33 AM

10171 posts since 9/23/2009

I would love to host a jam...except, nobody would come...so I’d end up back on the Presonus all by myself, probably. I know only hardcore bluegrass jammers...and the jams aren’t a lot of fun to me...I don’t know one person who would like to jam to the stuff I like...well, I do kniw people, but none within a couple hundred miles of me.

Mar 11, 2018 - 11:00:28 AM
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6768 posts since 3/19/2009

quote:
Originally posted by groundhogpeggy

I would love to host a jam...except, nobody would come...so I’d end up back on the Presonus all by myself, probably. I know only hardcore bluegrass jammers...and the jams aren’t a lot of fun to me...I don’t know one person who would like to jam to the stuff I like...well, I do kniw people, but none within a couple hundred miles of me.


Peggy, get a quote on a round trip bus ticket to Southern Indiana.. We'll do a fund raiser.. and make it happen..

Mar 11, 2018 - 8:05:09 PM

10171 posts since 9/23/2009

Lol...that’s a great thought, Lee. maybe one day I can get there. At this point we stay too busy to do much of anything.

Mar 13, 2018 - 8:30:11 PM
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943 posts since 3/19/2009

Lee, I’m just surprised you can get anyone to stay in one key for any length of time . . . let alone C. They change frequently here . . . which doesn’t really bother me, but the banjo pickers really moan a lot.
Personally, I like C. I propose you have a “C for Clifftop Jam” . . . I’ll be there. ??

Mar 25, 2018 - 12:49:33 PM
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506 posts since 9/4/2007

Take a job as backup fiddler for an eclectic band(there is more to fiddling than trying to look like you are from the thirties and learning a few old fiddle tunes). Not that one is better than the other BUT it will make you learn to play in every key! Don't get scared. There are only 12 notes. Learn them... Make it fun....

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