MikeWillner - Posted - 09/19/2023:  06:28:35

Hi,
I'm just getting started and have a student violin (which seems nicely set up and plays pretty well). I read that bluegrass fiddlers (which I hope to become one of) use a certain type of bridge, maybe a bit flatter to facilitate double stops.

Can someone recommend a brand or type I could look at and consider for upgrading my fiddle?

Thanks

UsuallyPickin - Posted - 09/19/2023:  06:45:33

The bluegrass flatter bridge facilitates changing from one set of strings to another while playing double stops. Something that takes time and practice. As a newbie it likely will make little difference to you other than when you move to a flatter bridge is more difficult to not play the wrong strings. On bridges, a good bridge will ring a brighter tone when dropped on a hard surface. A tink instead of a thunk, as it were. Aubert and Despiau are both quality bridges. Always keeping in mind that the fitting of any bridge is as important or more so, than the brand. Enjoy the process. R/

pete_fiddle - Posted - 09/19/2023:  06:59:39

"On bridges, a good bridge will ring a brighter tone when dropped on a hard surface."...Just make sure the bridge is not on your fiddle at the time..

The Violin Beautiful - Posted - 09/19/2023:  07:34:27

There is really no such thing as a “bluegrass bridge.” Some fiddlers do like a flatter curve, but it’s by no means standardized. It’s not uncommon to come across an old fiddle with a rather flat curve, but the reason for this is that many players try to fit their own bridges and don’t understand how to make a proper bridge curve, instead just putting string grooves into the bridge blank, which has a much flatter curve than a finished bridge.

There are different brands of bridges and different models among those brands, but ultimately what will make the real difference in the quality of the bridge is how well it’s cut. The bridge must be fitted exactly to the instrument. There’s a myth that classical bridges are designed to make it harder to play on multiple strings; the repertoire calls for plenty of use of multiple stops, and the bridge curve is optimized to allow for all styles of playing.

For the best results, consult a luthier. New York is full of them!

Lonesome Fiddler - Posted - 09/19/2023:  11:36:43

As Rich sez. I've probably said this already, a couple times here, but my three fiddles each have differently shaped bridges. Only takes a couple seconds to get jiggy with another one.

ChickenMan - Posted - 09/19/2023:  12:05:22

I think at least as many BG fiddlers play with a standard bridge setup as don't.



The main "advantage" of a flatter radius (but not flat and set up to match the fingerboard or however it's done) is so there is less arm movement from one string to the next and thus less energy spent lifting and lowering one's arm while playing long stretches for dances. If it makes double stops easier at all, it makes single strings harder.  

Edited by - ChickenMan on 09/19/2023 12:39:41

alaskafiddler - Posted - 09/19/2023:  23:47:04

quote:

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Originally posted by MikeWillner

Hi,

I'm just getting started and have a student violin (which seems nicely set up and plays pretty well). I read that bluegrass fiddlers (which I hope to become one of) use a certain type of bridge, maybe a bit flatter to facilitate double stops.



Can someone recommend a brand or type I could look at and consider for upgrading my fiddle?



Thanks

---

To add to what others stated; a lot of misunderstanding of flat bridge exists.

A double stop is simultaneously playing two adjacent strings. Between just two adjacent points (where strings sit on bridge) are a straight line. The visible arc on top of bridge is irrelevant to that.  Doesn't facilitate a single double stop on it's own. As Richard mentioned, the angle degrees slightly affects overall narrower or steeper crossing angle to those adjacent strings; another straight plane (how much, or important is up to individual).

As mentioned other thing to consider, too little and requires much more control to play a single string when needed. With that, something also might consider... esp BG players; playing up the neck, this becomes more of an issue; there are aspects about proper string height clearance for each string, diameter and tension, to match the curve and relief of fingerboard. Many folks just flatten (or notch deeper grooves) simply taking proper fit bridge, by lowering action, at least the middle D and A;  pushing the string down to fingerboard, will that string to be lower; much closer to plain of adjacent strings; less clearance. But as well, any bridge too low action can cause issue clearance, free play for some strings/tension; interfering with getting clean tone up neck. (similar in guitars, too low action or relief causing fret buzz). As beginner, perhaps might stick closer to the conventional string height clearance for each string, matching fingerboard radius (typical 42mm to 45mm or so).

alaskafiddler - Posted - 09/20/2023:  00:05:29

quote:

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Originally posted by ChickenMan

...so there is less arm movement from one string to the next and thus less energy spent lifting and lowering one's arm while playing long stretches for dances.

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Kind of had me wondering about that, as I heard this a lot.

First should mention, I don't get bow fatigued playing dances, or long jams. Even with lots of seconding in styles like Cajun. No matter what different radiuses bridges played; haven't noticed a whole significant difference in vertical motion, not enough to feel any difference in energy playing for long stretches due to that vertical axis energy savings.

That said, how much does it actually save vertical arm motion and energy? Difference in string crossing of 42mm to say pretty flat 56mm radius. If my rough trig is right, at the extreme full extension of bow tip (about 25 in), changes from about 6 inches to 5 inches with the much flatter radius; so maybe 1 inch at extreme extension, at more of mid bow, would be only half inch difference (42 to 56; in between would be less). So, for myself, I probably expend much more energy than that in horizontal axis; and energy in used wrist movement (rather than arm) perhaps makes seem less noticeable.

it makes single strings harder.

Agree, and might consider if have to do a lot of single string playing/rocking, and/or up neck... really flat bridges (like 54-60), overall requires much more control; so might find that constant tight precision control actually less relaxing, more fatiguing over a long period?

Of course, most of that music I play for long periods; while occasionally has big jumps from G to E strings; typically not much constant oscillating back and forth, nor every sixteenth note shuffle that wide range. Rather most phrases, changes between two strings for period (even with rocks, drones); with ascent/decent adjacent bit more linear smooth and gradual transgression. While that does often requires quick movement between adjacent string crossing, quicker needs to happen, more I think it helps to have a bit of +/- leeway on angle.

Just my observations, YMMV

bluegrassfiddle - Posted - 09/21/2023:  15:53:48

I like a bridge with a flatter curve better. I find them easier to play for faster songs where switching strings quickly is required. It makes me feel like I have to make less of a jump between strings. With a flatter curve (not completely flat just to clarify) it makes it feel smoother when switching strings quickly. I think a lot of it comes down to personal preference.

I don’t know any brands to recommend, as far as I know it makes more of a difference who shaped and set the bridge as opposed to the brand.