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 ARCHIVED TOPIC: Help learning Stampede by Alan Kaufman by ear


Please note this is an archived topic, so it is locked and unable to be replied to. You may, however, start a new topic and refer to this topic with a link: http://www.fiddlehangout.com/archive/54292

cunparis - Posted - 11/18/2020:  11:36:06


I'm new to learning tunes by ear. I've been at it a couple months and I can already see an improvement. So I tried to learn this tune I like but it's way too advanced for me. It has tons of double stops and that's really throwing me off. I put it on a loop and let it go for an hour. Usually that's more than enough for me to be able to play it. But I'm completely lost on this one.

The tune is Stampede by Alan Kaufman and you can hear it here:

youtube.com/watch?v=3QS0YrpoVZk

I really love his playing. I took a few workshops with him in the Fiddle Hell a few weeks ago. He taught Sally Goodin really well, a simplified version and then proceeded to make magic with it using double stops, rhythm, groove, etc. And I love that magic going on in Stampede, and there's lots of it.

If anyone can give point me in the right direction I would really appreciate it. I don't know if others can play this after hearing a few times or if it's difficult for others as well.

Thanks

Swing - Posted - 11/18/2020:  11:59:35


It looks like he is playing in the key of A..the guitar player is capped up two frets and playing in G...so what Alan is playing sounds like a chord for the first double stop, could be an A or a D.. I don't have my fiddle right here to try it... hope this helps

Play Happy

Swing

pete_fiddle - Posted - 11/18/2020:  12:45:45


What Swing says, Work out the chords, ...Sing the melody with the chords...Then play the melody on the fiddle... Add the double stops to emphasize the chord changes...Add your own flavours

Sounds like the chords are D, A and G for the first part. And A, and Bm for the second to me...With the cadences to go from the first part to the second and back again.

Good luck pete

DougD - Posted - 11/18/2020:  13:01:41


The A part is mostly D and G, with an A chord near the end. The B part is A and F# minor.
There's really not too much to the melody - its kind of a "groove" tune.
Good luck.

ChickenMan - Posted - 11/18/2020:  14:21:12


Key of D I think - first chord is capo'd C = D. 

Are you tuned ADae low to high as he says he is in the video description? It is not at all complicated compared to many tunes. What you are calling double stops are mostly open strings against a stopped note on another string. The coarse part (B part) is mostly E, F# and G (and D) on the D string, if that helps. When he goes up an octave it is the same notes mostly played on the E string (with the exception of the D note).



Why is everyone talking about the chords?


Edited by - ChickenMan on 11/18/2020 14:22:37

mmuussiiccaall - Posted - 11/18/2020:  14:35:17




Here's how I think about it in my head using intervals of the scale. The underlined numbers are black on the visual. BTW this is the melody only, no drones.

 


alanfiddler - Posted - 11/19/2020:  08:19:35


Hi There this is Alan Kaufman
glad you like Stampede
Yes it is in ADAE
it is on Youtube and you can go on settings and slow it down
This is from Vern's notes on backup
Capo2
CCCF CCCF
CCCF GGGC x2

GGGG AmAmAmAm
GGGG AmAmAmAm x2
F
Go to F on 2nd of B!

I would be glad to help out with anyone trying to learn my tunes on zoom or skype

more of my tunes can be found here

tinyurl.com/alantunes

cunparis - Posted - 11/19/2020:  11:29:12


quote:

Originally posted by mmuussiiccaall



Here's how I think about it in my head using intervals of the scale. The underlined numbers are black on the visual. BTW this is the melody only, no drones.

 






Thanks everyone for the tips, especially mmuussiiccaall who was very kind to write out the notes.  I messed around with this for a while and I could play the main notes of the melody, without all the little notes.  But it's the little notes and the groove that really make this tune.  I'm going to work on it a bit more but I'm pretty sure it's too advanced for me.  It won't sound right without the double stops and all the extra magic. :)



 



 

cunparis - Posted - 11/19/2020:  12:05:14


quote:

Originally posted by alanfiddler

Hi There this is Alan Kaufman

glad you like Stampede

Yes it is in ADAE

 






Hi Alan,



It's great to see you here.  Thanks for the notes on the guitar backup.  And thanks for sharing your tunes.  :)



 

pete_fiddle - Posted - 11/19/2020:  12:05:39


quote:

Originally posted by ChickenMan

Key of D I think - first chord is capo'd C = D. 

Are you tuned ADae low to high as he says he is in the video description? It is not at all complicated compared to many tunes. What you are calling double stops are mostly open strings against a stopped note on another string. The coarse part (B part) is mostly E, F# and G (and D) on the D string, if that helps. When he goes up an octave it is the same notes mostly played on the E string (with the exception of the D note).



Why is everyone talking about the chords?






The chords to me are a container for the melody, an indication of the key or mode, a statement of the form, and a vehicle for the rhythm. The melody sits within these parameters, and either goes with or against them to create tension or release. They are the Background for the melody. i always try to think of them first so i can "hear" the tune in context.... Albeit my own context, it may coincide with someone else's or harmonize with someone else's hopefully.


.....But mostly i just look at the guitarists fingers, follow them with double stops, (open or closed), then work out the melody accordingly...wink

RichJ - Posted - 11/23/2020:  08:05:52


quote:

Originally posted by alanfiddler

Hi There this is Alan Kaufman

glad you like Stampede

Yes it is in ADAE

it is on Youtube and you can go on settings and slow it down

This is from Vern's notes on backup

Capo2

CCCF CCCF

CCCF GGGC x2



GGGG AmAmAmAm

GGGG AmAmAmAm x2

F

Go to F on 2nd of B!

 




Maybe everyone else is already aware of  this, but those chords are for a "Capo2" guitar. They look like key of C chords but I guess wind up as A to fit what the fiddle is playing. 

groundhogpeggy - Posted - 11/23/2020:  09:29:50


Very nice tune and nice of Alan to offer to help anyone wanting to play!



By the way, capo 2 with C chords ends up playing in D. ADAE is a good cross tuning for playing in D too...AEAE is for playing in AA, but normally ADAE works out for playing in D.  It just has the bass string up one so you can get a good drone without any fingers on the bass string and you can easily get the unison note on finger 3 on the bass string.  It ain't really much difference to think of as a cross tuning...just the one string, but it's very handy and helpful for the key of D.  But the capo...it's up two half steps higher playing C...so one half step/fret is C# and the next half step...fret, where you put the capo, would be in D.  


Edited by - groundhogpeggy on 11/23/2020 09:37:07

pete_fiddle - Posted - 11/23/2020:  10:48:30


quote:

Originally posted by groundhogpeggy

Very nice tune and nice of Alan to offer to help anyone wanting to play!



By the way, capo 2 with C chords ends up playing in D.






True

cunparis - Posted - 11/24/2020:  01:27:38


While watching videos in Alan's youtube stream, I came across this one. He explains how he composes tunes and he demonstrates how a little seed grows into a tune. Also interesting is how he builds it up. I think this is very relevant to learning Stampede and I plan to study it more and play along.

youtube.com/watch?v=XsoU9qF4Hs...=youtu.be

groundhogpeggy - Posted - 11/24/2020:  04:16:36


Oops, I think when I posted above, I misunderstood what the actual issue was about the key...sorry...guys, forgive me if what I said was not quite what we were discussing...I wish I could say it was the first time...lol.

Thanks for the interesting link, Michael.

groundhogpeggy - Posted - 11/24/2020:  05:25:38


oops again...got interrupted before I could complete the thought...I thought we were talking key, not progression/modulation or whatever.

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