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 ARCHIVED TOPIC: Cross tuning?


Please note this is an archived topic, so it is locked and unable to be replied to. You may, however, start a new topic and refer to this topic with a link: http://www.fiddlehangout.com/archive/35147

Bluegrassgirl 1952 - Posted - 10/09/2013:  16:44:15


Relatively new fiddler here. Can anyone tell me what key this tune is being played in? I think it is cross tuned to AEAE but not sure. The song is The Blackist Crow by Red Tail Ring and it is on Youtube. What a beautiful song. Thanks for any help.


bsed - Posted - 10/09/2013:  18:47:16


I think we'll need a link to refer to.


boxbow - Posted - 10/09/2013:  19:37:39


The version I've listened to most is cross-tuned, but I've never looked to see if it was cross A or cross G.


mswlogo - Posted - 10/09/2013:  21:02:26


I assume you mean this gal. Pretty awesome playing. Great find. I'm gonna check out their CD.



youtube.com/watch?v=4wRnDa7GdzQ



I think you're right on AEAE and I think they are playing it in E.



This used to be my favorite version, but I think you may have just bumped it.



youtube.com/watch?v=Qc2gMzj2qZU



Bruce Molsky does it as well (His CD version is better)



youtube.com/watch?v=d6jh1vqNvMs


mswlogo - Posted - 10/10/2013:  21:01:37


I've been playing along with this Red Tail Ring version since you put the ear worm in my head.



Poking around with it I'm not sure about E and AEAE.



The phrases (or parts) end on a C# note, which I believe is a C#minor chord. That so happens to be the relative minor of E and a mistake I often make.



So it could be in C#minor. But the other chords (I'm guessing are B's A's and and lots of E's). But those don't fit the chord progressions I'm familiar with.



But if you consider it as in the Key of E, the A's and B's are the 4th and 5th. But it starts on B and ends on C#.



Also although AEAE is a lot easier to play the Melody in, it doesn't help much for drones in C#m. No idea what the crossing tuning would be for C#m.



AEAE doesn't seem to match her fingering either. Googling around tunes in E are sometimes tuned in EEBE



It might be some modal key that has the same signature as E or C#m



 



Edited by - mswlogo on 10/10/2013 21:04:00

DougD - Posted - 10/11/2013:  02:26:39


Its in E, but I don't know the tuning. They've just changed the chords and melody quite a bit from the version by Tommy Jarrel that most people have learned from:  youtube.com/watch?v=nUa5ikrLPj...=youtu.be



On their website  redtailring.com/   is the slogan "Old Time Roots, New Time Sounds" which pretty well describes their approach to their music - more on this page:  redtailring.com/Story.html



Edited by - DougD on 10/11/2013 02:36:33

Bluegrassgirl 1952 - Posted - 10/11/2013:  05:45:43


I'm out of my depth on this song but will keep plugging along with it. Thank you for your help. This song gets in your head. It is an easy little song to play but what she adds to it



brings it alive.


bwright - Posted - 10/11/2013:  06:35:16


I'm learning this tune myself and per the Brad Leftwich book on Round Peak style the tuning is AEAE.

Bluegrassgirl 1952 - Posted - 10/15/2013:  13:37:58


I received a response from the group Red Tail Ring about the cross tuning of their song "The Blackest Crow". The tuning is E,B,F#,C#.



 Basically, the whole fiddle is tuned down a step



and a half and the tune is played out of the G Position. I hope this helps anyone who loves the way they play this song.


mswlogo - Posted - 10/15/2013:  14:54:05


Cool, no wonder AEAE was not making sense watching her fingers.



Thanks. I'm gonna try that tuning.



I think the correct way to say it is, down "3 half steps".



By the way I know nothing about Guitar I tried to look up where he had his Capo to see if it provided any hints.



I think he is playing, like it was fingered in D. He has it on the 2nd Fret and getting E from playing like it was D.





 



Edited by - mswlogo on 10/15/2013 15:00:01

ChickenMan - Posted - 10/15/2013:  15:39:20


mswlogo - you are correct, he his playing out of D for the key of E. Also, he has tuned the low E string down a full step (or two half steps - which would be a weird way to refer to a full step BTW) for a nice full, fat chord sound.

mswlogo - Posted - 11/04/2013:  21:14:31


quote:

Originally posted by Bluegrassgirl 1952

 

I received a response from the group Red Tail Ring about the cross tuning of their song "The Blackest Crow". The tuning is E,B,F#,C#.




 Basically, the whole fiddle is tuned down a step




and a half and the tune is played out of the G Position. I hope this helps anyone who loves the way they play this song.







Did anyone try this tuning. It sounded awful for me. I have tried Cajun tuning in the past on Cajun tunes (down one full step) and it sounded great. But this extra half step put the fiddle over the edge.



I've been practicing it in E and it has a nice sound in standard tuning (without any drones). I tried keys G and D and it just doesn't sound as good as in E.



I don't use E often, so it's good practice.


petehay - Posted - 11/05/2013:  12:54:25


I've been using it on a cheap, cheap, cheap eBay fiddle since I first read this thread and it sounds pretty good. I've  mostly stayed in what I know as D (but would be B in this tuning) droning everything. Fiddle is set up with Prims. It's fun.



Pete in Portland


fiddlinsteudel - Posted - 11/07/2013:  09:12:20


As a person who rarely cross tunes (just started this for the first time this year to play wagon wheel (sigh)) do you folks retune during a set? Or do you just play in one tuning for most of it. I find it frustrating to try and retune the fiddle from song to song. I've been playing in gigs where the fiddle slipped out of tune and I just had to play the top AE for the rest of the tune. Any tricks to tuning on the fly? The only tuning I've played with is AEAE. I usually tune the G first then the D and then reverse the order when going back to GDAE.


mswlogo - Posted - 11/07/2013:  09:27:11


quote:

Originally posted by fiddlinsteudel

 

As a person who rarely cross tunes (just started this for the first time this year to play wagon wheel (sigh)) do you folks retune during a set? Or do you just play in one tuning for most of it. I find it frustrating to try and retune the fiddle from song to song. I've been playing in gigs where the fiddle slipped out of tune and I just had to play the top AE for the rest of the tune. Any tricks to tuning on the fly? The only tuning I've played with is AEAE. I usually tune the G first then the D and then reverse the order when going back to GDAE.






In Old Time Jams the group stays in one tuning (Key) for a while, then switches to another for a while.



If it was Cajun, you'd stay in Cajun tuning :)



 



 



Edited by - mswlogo on 11/07/2013 09:28:07

fiddlinsteudel - Posted - 11/07/2013:  09:30:21


quote:

Originally posted by mswlogo

 
quote:


Originally posted by fiddlinsteudel

 


As a person who rarely cross tunes (just started this for the first time this year to play wagon wheel (sigh)) do you folks retune during a set? Or do you just play in one tuning for most of it. I find it frustrating to try and retune the fiddle from song to song. I've been playing in gigs where the fiddle slipped out of tune and I just had to play the top AE for the rest of the tune. Any tricks to tuning on the fly? The only tuning I've played with is AEAE. I usually tune the G first then the D and then reverse the order when going back to GDAE.








In Old Time Jams the group stays in one tuning (Key) for a while, then switches to another for a while.




If it was Cajun, you'd stay in Cajun tuning :)




 




 







So ... that means I need to buy some more fiddles.


MikeyBoy - Posted - 11/07/2013:  10:32:14


quote:

Originally posted by fiddlinsteudel

 
quote:


Originally posted by mswlogo

 


quote:


Originally posted by fiddlinsteudel

 


As a person who rarely cross tunes (just started this for the first time this year to play wagon wheel (sigh)) do you folks retune during a set? Or do you just play in one tuning for most of it. I find it frustrating to try and retune the fiddle from song to song. I've been playing in gigs where the fiddle slipped out of tune and I just had to play the top AE for the rest of the tune. Any tricks to tuning on the fly? The only tuning I've played with is AEAE. I usually tune the G first then the D and then reverse the order when going back to GDAE.








In Old Time Jams the group stays in one tuning (Key) for a while, then switches to another for a while.




If it was Cajun, you'd stay in Cajun tuning :)




 




 








So ... that means I need to buy some more fiddles.







Yes.  I have found that to be the best solution. I have one I leave in GDGD, one standard, and one DDAD (I want more because who doesn't).  If you can't do multiple fiddles, at least get some perfection pegs installed, they make tuning on the fly easy. 


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