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bluesviolin - Posted - 01/27/2012: 10:28:26
I recently discovered this thru a youtube guitar teacher David Walliman. The min7b5 arp is a Locrian mode, and because of the nature of this beast, the applicable Locrian arp can be very effectively blended in with ANY mode scale.
eg: if in C dorian, the applicable locrian arp would be Amin7b5 - A C Eb G A C Eb G....
the locrian arps will only hit on notes that are contained in the given mode scale. The amazing thing is, the arps will take on the color of any given mode and then walk it a little ways outside.
but the real kicker for me was... when this David Walliman fellow was explaining this, I realized I've known about these arpeggios for 20 years but thought of them as min6 arps. Turns out they're exactly the same thing, just inversions. I was blowin' my mind when the light started to go on cuz I've got all these arps memorized over 4 strings in 6 or 7 keys. Thing is, I only had applications for them over a blues IV chord. never knew they could be applied over any mode.
There are LOT'S of guitar players into this. Fiddle players, not so much. Jazzers do this but I believe they tend to think of it in different ways.
When I get home tonight, I'll type out a link to that vid for anyone interested.
Edited by - bluesviolin on 01/27/2012 15:16:14
bluesviolin - Posted - 01/27/2012: 17:48:13
youtube.com/watch?v=UM_EvoSMyB...e=related
here's that link I was talking about. Can't decide which I'm more excited about, these Locrian arpeggio's or discovering Lydian mode. I think it's about 50/50
the specific examples start around 2:30 
Peghead - Posted - 01/30/2012: 13:22:33
I like the sound of the Locrian over the 5 chord. It's especially cool in Texas style contest tunes. It's closely related to the 7th chord (Mixo) but the accented notes are shifted and it has a diminished quality.
bluesviolin - Posted - 01/30/2012: 15:46:14
could you help me out further on this please, Peghead. (always looking for more to do over the 5 chord) can you figure out a way to let me know exactly how to do this? give me a 5 chord and the starting note for the locrian scale, or better yet, which major scale it would be as it applies to that 5 chord?
I know that putting a regular diminished scale in and out of the 4 chord is done, but I'm not as fluent with dim scales. So a major scale in locrian mode that has a diminished quality over the 5 chord.... well, it almost sounds like cheating 
but cheating in a very good way!
I would really be into this!
Peghead - Posted - 01/31/2012: 05:32:24
I'm more than glad to, but just hang in there, I can't get to it for a day or two.
Peghead - Posted - 02/01/2012: 10:04:35
quote:
Originally posted by bluesviolin
could you help me out further on this please, Peghead. (always looking for more to do over the 5 chord) can you figure out a way to let me know exactly how to do this? give me a 5 chord and the starting note for the locrian scale, or better yet, which major scale it would be as it applies to that 5 chord?
It's actually pretty easy. Use the Locrian mode (from the key you are in) over the 5 chord. For example, in the key of C the 5 chord is G. The Locrian mode (in C ) starts on B (B C D E F G A B) If you extract the 1,3, 5 arpeggio from the mode you get B, D, F, B If you play this on the fiddle starting on the low B, you get the flavor of it. The interval between F,and B is the clincher. It is wide 1-1/2 steps (diminished?) and the chord shape is a scrunched up thing with the index finger over. If you look at the notes you can see how it works over a G chord. It's really a G7 chord because of the F which creates a second half step tension to a C chord (the B wants to resolve up to C and the F want to resolve down to E. It has a goofy ragtime kind of feel because of the wide interval. It's not right everywhere but is great for variations especially in Texas and Midwest type tunes. In G mixolydian the F is a passing tone, the arpeggio skips right over it. In Locrian the F is a prominent tone. Hope that explains it.
Edited by - Peghead on 02/01/2012 10:09:25
bluesviolin - Posted - 02/01/2012: 16:32:03
when playing this thru, it looks like this is what I was talking about in my OP about min7b5 (locrian) arps applied over any mode. A full B locrian arp would be B D F A(?) notice the F & B. and this same B locrian arp could be applied over C Ionian, D dorian, E Pyrgian, F lydian, G mixo, & A aeolian.
for practical purposes... say you're doing some heavy metal in E phyrgian...try that B locrian arp over the E pyhrgian scale. Phyrgian can be heavy, add the loc arp for wild & crazy.
or perhaps you're doing some spacey stuff in F Lydian... that B locrian arp will take it just a little further outside, but still hitting only the notes of an F lydian scale (which is the same as a Cmaj scale)
You might prefer some smooth blues in D dorian. The B locrian arp will open it up.
G mixo = B locrian arp. sounds like some kinda renegade run over mixo.
That David Walliman link I posted explains this all very well. Just getting into modal pentatonics which works on pretty much the same principal.
Peghead, it seems to me we were talking about pretty much the same thing, and if so, very cool to get confirmation on stuff.
Edited by - bluesviolin on 02/01/2012 16:44:28
