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Lydia Johnson

2 posts
since 5/9/17

05/12/2017 09:33:20 Reply with Quote

There is no outright way to get fiddle tune history perfect, because there is way more than one straight story for any given tune. For instance; all we know about Soldier’s Joy is that a grandpa wrote it. It wasn’t everybody’s grandpa, and it was somebody’s grandpa, but whose remains a mystery.

We know also that Black Mountain Blues was played by Leslie Keith, but he says he learned it from his father. Nevertheless, the copyright is still in Leslie’s name.

Arthur Smith didn’t write Red Apple Rag, but his name is on the copyright, and Chubby Wise is almost never mentioned in conjunction with The Orange Blossom Special, the song that he wrote with Ervin T. Rouse.

 Three Forks of Reedy is supposed to be a North Carolina tune—but others say that Ward Jarvis (from West Virginia) wrote it. Ed Haley, another West Virginia fiddler plays it as Three Forks of Sandy, so the origin as well as the title is still unknown. This also casts into doubt the other tunes that Ward supposedly wrote, like Pretty Little Indian, and Banjo Tramp.

 And as for Ridge Runner, or sometimes called Angeline the Baker, it differs from the Stephen Foster version of Angeline the Baker. It also shares a second part with the old children’s song, Going Over the Sea. I don’t know if somebody was drunk or how they came up with this version of Angeline the Baker, but it really isn’t Angeline the Baker at all.

 Chinquapin Hunting, that marvelous tune in D, or A, or E, or maybe all three, is just one example of so many tunes that share a name with another totally incongruent tune. Others include Sally Anne, Hell Among the Yearlings, Fisher’s Hornpipe, Cotton-Eyed Joe etc.

Also tunes with different names, like Brushy Fork of John’s Creek (which is commonly known as Poor Man’s Trouble, Chinquapin) is not only the title of numerous different tunes, but also the name of Crooked Stovepipe, and Sally Anne and Sally Anne Johnson are always different no matter where they’re played and confused at will. Fisher’s Hornpipe could also be called Fischer’s Hornpipe or College Hornpipe.

There are also songs like Blackberry Blossom and then Garfield’s Blackberry Blossom—two different tunes by the way—that makes it so hard to search for one and not find a whole lineup of weird songs.

 And then we just have plain ol’ copyright blunders. I even saw once where Stuart Duncan was credited with writing Lee Highway Blues. The reason I know that isn’t true is this: he would have had to author said tune when he was the ripe old age of 3 or so. I wish I could stick around for about a hundred years to see what tunes I came up with.I am doing an extensive old-time fiddle tune research project, and although I don't expect a correct answer, is there anyone out there with a different perspective on these questions? 

Aisha

United States
7 posts since 7/13/10

05/12/2017 10:00:34 Reply with Quote

I think one of the things that makes it a little confusing is that, in old time, we say things like, "this is Pretty Little Indian, from Ward Jarvis" which means that he was the earliest source that we know of, but it doesn't necessarily mean he actually wrote the tune himself. I find learning about the history of tunes almost as fun as playing them!

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amwildman

United States
1897 posts since 12/23/07

05/12/2017 10:07:13View amwildman's MP3 Archive Reply with Quote

quote:
Originally posted by Lydia Johnson

I am doing an extensive old-time fiddle tune research project, and although I don't expect a correct answer, is there anyone out there with a different perspective on these questions? 


The only question I see is your very last one.  Everything else in your post is a statement.  To which questions are you referring?

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Tobus

United States
180 posts since 5/7/15

05/12/2017 12:48:43 View Tobus's Photo Albums Reply with Quote

Fisher's Hornpipe and College Hornpipe are two completely different tunes.  Maybe I just don't get around as much as others, but I've never heard anyone confuse the two.  However, College Hornpipe and Sailor's Hornpipe are the same tune (also known as the Popeye tune).

Fiddle tunes are like any other oral (or aural) tradition.  Lots of variations, and nobody knows exactly where they came from.  But humans have a primal desire for the tradition.


Edited by - Tobus on 05/12/2017 12:49:05

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UsuallyPickinPlayers Union Member

United States
1667 posts since 10/1/08

05/12/2017 12:52:53 View UsuallyPickin's Blog Reply with Quote

Also .... people are credited and their copyright refers to an arrangement of a tune or song. Akin to "this is Pretty Little Indian from Ward Jarvis" but with a legal rather than an historical or apocryphal fundament. R/

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Lee M

United States
5739 posts since 3/19/09

Online

05/12/2017 14:33:47View Lee M's MP3 Archive View Lee M's Photo Albums View Lee M's Blog Reply with Quote

Lydia, that is great stuff.. You have certainly done your homework..It is sort of how I feel about what a tune should sound like.. What version of Soldier's Joy is the ORIGINAL version ?? Also, most musicians play variations of variations of variations, so not only is it hard to say where a tune came from, it is also hard to say just what EXACTLY is the Tune???  

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alaskafiddler

2073 posts since 9/13/09

05/13/2017 06:24:34View alaskafiddler's MP3 Archive View alaskafiddler's Photo Albums View alaskafiddler's Blog Reply with Quote

quote:
Originally posted by Lydia Johnson
 

There is no outright way to get fiddle tune history perfect, because there is way more than one straight story for any given tune.

I am doing an extensive old-time fiddle tune research project, and although I don't expect a correct answer, is there anyone out there with a different perspective on these questions? 


There have been some good ethnomusicology articles that put a different perspective.  In that these tunes and songs were not quite written the way we think of composers, composing ... and the idea of originality... but were a bit communal compositions. 

How tunes gets shaped and adapted by the players... often many players along the way... and at some point become almost unrecognizable form some original source. As well they might borrow some phrase from one tune and put it in another. They just molded tunes/songs they heard to their own liking. They were not really concerned with in playing or preserving  (like Classical composition)  an idea of "as written": - but made tunes, songs their own.

As well they didn't have the mp3 cataloged, the web, or really much recordings, sheet music...   so tunes and names of tunes were passed orally... but not always remembered entirely.  So might not recall exactly how a tune went... but remember a cool part of it... and then find something else they heard, maybe adapt it... and put that in to make a good tune.  Of course many folks didn't hear or can't recall names of tunes.... so they might just make up one for the tune they play.  One can recognize a lot of similarities in phrases from one tune to another. Similar in how folk lyrics are similar and borrowed. Lot's of American OT tunes have similarities to some old Irish or Scottish tunes... but different.

The tune Angelina Baker probably came from hearing Stephan Foster's; and can recognize some of the similarity and phrases... but someone took the melodic theme and changed it (forgot or purposely, or combination), but then again... maybe part of the phrases in what SF wrote was based on or borrowed from a fiddle tune or song (of different name) he heard?

One aspect of more communal compositions of old... they were not thought of as something of ownership, in the way publishing and copyrights work, or anything to make money from.  So who actually originally wrote a tune or song perhaps wasn't something they really thought important. Again, playing or singing the tune in a way that made it your own, perhaps seemed to be more important.


Edited by - alaskafiddler on 05/13/2017 06:27:55

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Addie

1762 posts since 6/6/12

05/13/2017 09:30:14View Addie's MP3 Archive View Addie's Photo Albums Reply with Quote

A grandpa wrote Soldier's Joy?

I thought it was published by Rutherford in 1756, and James Aird in 1778.  I suppose they might have been somebody's grand dad, though...

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abinigia

United States
842 posts since 8/27/08

05/13/2017 09:48:04View abinigia's MP3 Archive View abinigia's Photo Albums View abinigia's Blog Reply with Quote

quote:
Originally posted by alaskafiddler
 
There have been some good ethnomusicology articles that put a different perspective.  In that these tunes and songs were not quite written the way we think of composers, composing ... and the idea of originality... but were a bit communal compositions. 

How tunes gets shaped and adapted by the players... often many players along the way... and at some point become almost unrecognizable form some original source. As well they might borrow some phrase from one tune and put it in another. They just molded tunes/songs they heard to their own liking. They were not really concerned with in playing or preserving  (like Classical composition)  an idea of "as written": - but made tunes, songs their own.

As well they didn't have the mp3 cataloged, the web, or really much recordings, sheet music...   so tunes and names of tunes were passed orally... but not always remembered entirely.  So might not recall exactly how a tune went... but remember a cool part of it... and then find something else they heard, maybe adapt it... and put that in to make a good tune.  Of course many folks didn't hear or can't recall names of tunes.... so they might just make up one for the tune they play.  One can recognize a lot of similarities in phrases from one tune to another. Similar in how folk lyrics are similar and borrowed. Lot's of American OT tunes have similarities to some old Irish or Scottish tunes... but different.

The tune Angelina Baker probably came from hearing Stephan Foster's; and can recognize some of the similarity and phrases... but someone took the melodic theme and changed it (forgot or purposely, or combination), but then again... maybe part of the phrases in what SF wrote was based on or borrowed from a fiddle tune or song (of different name) he heard?

One aspect of more communal compositions of old... they were not thought of as something of ownership, in the way publishing and copyrights work, or anything to make money from.  So who actually originally wrote a tune or song perhaps wasn't something they really thought important. Again, playing or singing the tune in a way that made it your own, perhaps seemed to be more important.


Those are all good points. What's different now is the current players of old time fiddle tunes, us, are making definations that will last forever. The era of true Folk music is over. We are left to catalog it as well as we can. From here on out there is a record of everything. So in ascribing authorship it's worth trying to be faithful to the pioneers of this style while recognizing that all of these tunes were collaberative to various degrees. It was a wonderful era. Now we try to play what they did, or else actually compose new tunes in the style of old ones.

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Lydia Johnson

2 posts since 5/9/17

05/13/2017 11:20:37 Reply with Quote

I would like to thank all of you for a response...and am happy to admit that I did get some answers. Maybe I came off a little stronger than I truly feel. I have been studying fiddle tunes online in my spare time, and it's very difficult. As far as what questions I still have, I am mostly looking for someone to narrow down all these stories and legends of fiddle tunes that I hear from all directions (like the response I received from someone concerning Soldier's Joy, I can't remember who it was...sorry.:) and if anyone has any information of old-time fiddle tunes from anywhere but in particular in West Virginia I would love to hear from you. I have a lot of the tune names themselves, but not many of the stories behind them.  

Please watch my video, Blue Valley, and let me know what you think. That's Hannah on the mandolin--she's the mandolinist for our group, The Johnsons' Bluegrass Band. You can find the band on facebook @ www.facebook.com/Johnsons'Bluegrass.  


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Fiddler

United States
3488 posts since 6/22/07

Online

05/13/2017 14:47:33View Fiddler's MP3 Archive View Fiddler's Photo Albums View Fiddler's Blog Reply with Quote

Also consider "The Yellow Rose of Texas." There is the Christy's Plantation Melodies. No. 2 version with a sheet music publication in 1858. The tune refers to the most decisive 18 minutes of US history at the Battle of San Jacinto and the legend of the mulatto who kept Santa Anna "occupied" while Sam Houston made his attack. However, many of us old time fiddlers play at variation of this tune that seems to have emerged in Virginia/West Va, N. Carolina sometime around the Civil War or later that sounds like the original, but it is not.

There are other examples of popular, copyrighted tunes that entered into folk traditions and morphed significantly for what ever reason - misremembered, changed to suit the musician playing it, changed to suit the people of the region, changed by blending with local music traditions.

One valuable resource is the Fiddler's Companion. This has lots of tunes with well documented histories and bibliographies.

http://www.ibiblio.org/fiddlers/

For example: here's the link to the entry for Soldiers Joy. More information than you can shake a stick at!!

Like others have said, many of us cite the source for our version of a tune. Personally, I think the tune origins and history is interesting, but I don't let it confine my playing. I let it inform my playing. I will never sound like those early 20th Century  recordings because I have been exposed to rock and roll, swing, jazz, classical and other "modern" music forms.

Good luck with your project.

 

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Lonesome Fiddler

1006 posts since 12/11/08

05/13/2017 15:17:37View Lonesome Fiddler's MP3 Archive View Lonesome Fiddler's Photo Albums Reply with Quote

Scholarship is wonderful, but something's got to be said for simply being part of the ongoing folk tradition.  If you are playing alongside others, play the tunes in a way that best matches or best complements what the others are playing.  If you're playing alone on your front porch, play the tunes the way you hear them, or the way your fingers seem to want to play them.  If your particular take on a tune strikes a chord(!) with those listening to you or those playing alongside you, so much the better.    Who knows?  Maybe seventy or so years on, some scholar will hear your rendition on a scratchy old digital file and declare it the only proper way to play it. 

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bsedPlayers Union Member

United States
3843 posts since 6/23/07

05/13/2017 19:48:46View bsed's MP3 Archive View bsed's Classified Ads View bsed's Photo Albums View bsed's Blog Reply with Quote

quote:
Originally posted by Lydia Johnson
 

 

Arthur Smith didn’t write Red Apple Rag, but his name is on the copyright, and Chubby Wise is almost never mentioned in conjunction with The Orange Blossom Special, the song that he wrote with Ervin T. Rouse.

 


There seems to be two tunes I've found that are called Red Apple Rag. There's one that most people play. But then there's another that I learned from Suzy Thompson that she called Red Apple Rag. It's not the one most people play, and I have found that Arthur Smith played this particular tune. Not sure if he called it Red Apple Rag, though. There's also a You Tube of Chirps playing this same A. Smith tune, and he called it R.A.R. But I just call it Arthur Smith's Rag to keep the tunes separate.

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Shawn Craver

United States
681 posts since 3/24/10

05/14/2017 22:34:20View Shawn Craver's MP3 Archive View Shawn Craver's Photo Albums Reply with Quote

Naah. The "true era of folk music is over" isn't true. Just because "old-time" music is dominated by revivalists, doesn't mean that old time fiddle is limited to revivalists and their impositions or views on the music. Or that everything is sourced or recorded. I am beginning to see tunes come into the revivalist scene that I learned straight from living trad. fiddlers. Old Hang On (Phoebe Ice), Squirrel Hunters, Hell on the Potomac... Not everyone can have that experience, but it ain't dead.

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soppinthegravy

173 posts since 7/26/15

05/15/2017 14:44:40View soppinthegravy's MP3 Archive View soppinthegravy's Photo Albums Reply with Quote

How do you know for sure that Arthur didn't write Red Apple Rag? I've never heard that before. There is already a "Smith's Rag" by Arthur. 

quote:
Originally posted by bsed
 
quote:
Originally posted by Lydia Johnson
 

 

Arthur Smith didn’t write Red Apple Rag, but his name is on the copyright, and Chubby Wise is almost never mentioned in conjunction with The Orange Blossom Special, the song that he wrote with Ervin T. Rouse.

 


There seems to be two tunes I've found that are called Red Apple Rag. There's one that most people play. But then there's another that I learned from Suzy Thompson that she called Red Apple Rag. It's not the one most people play, and I have found that Arthur Smith played this particular tune. Not sure if he called it Red Apple Rag, though. There's also a You Tube of Chirps playing this same A. Smith tune, and he called it R.A.R. But I just call it Arthur Smith's Rag to keep the tunes separate.


 


Edited by - soppinthegravy on 05/15/2017 14:56:36

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soppinthegravy

173 posts since 7/26/15

05/15/2017 15:07:43View soppinthegravy's MP3 Archive View soppinthegravy's Photo Albums Reply with Quote

Right. I've tried to make people understand that, but nobody listens to me. They would rather take a workshop by a revivalist scholar than to visit with a person who actually grew up in the tradition.    

quote:
Originally posted by Shawn Craver
 

Naah. The "true era of folk music is over" isn't true. Just because "old-time" music is dominated by revivalists, doesn't mean that old time fiddle is limited to revivalists and their impositions or views on the music. Or that everything is sourced or recorded. I am beginning to see tunes come into the revivalist scene that I learned straight from living trad. fiddlers. Old Hang On (Phoebe Ice), Squirrel Hunters, Hell on the Potomac... Not everyone can have that experience, but it ain't dead.


 

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DougD

United States
8188 posts since 12/2/07

05/15/2017 15:31:57View DougD's MP3 Archive View DougD's Photo Albums Reply with Quote

I have a few more things I might add to this topic, but I'll just mention that in the Victor ledgers there is no composer credit for Arthur Smith's recording of "Red Apple Rag." That doesn't mean much really, just that they didn't pay him composer's royalties, but i always thought he wrote it. If not him then who did?

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soppinthegravy

173 posts since 7/26/15

05/15/2017 20:28:48View soppinthegravy's MP3 Archive View soppinthegravy's Photo Albums Reply with Quote

The safest thing to say, in my opinion, is, regardless of who wrote the original, the artist in question wrote his/her version of the tune.

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Shawn Craver

United States
681 posts since 3/24/10

05/15/2017 22:20:34View Shawn Craver's MP3 Archive View Shawn Craver's Photo Albums Reply with Quote

 

I find myself getting along with trad Irish musicians from Ireland. It feels like "home". Different music, yes... but the respect for tradition and the raditional approach is very real. 

 

quote:
Originally posted by soppinthegravy
 

Right. I've tried to make people understand that, but nobody listens to me. They would rather take a workshop by a revivalist scholar than to visit with a person who actually grew up in the tradition.    

quote:
Originally posted by Shawn Craver
 

Naah. The "true era of folk music is over" isn't true. Just because "old-time" music is dominated by revivalists, doesn't mean that old time fiddle is limited to revivalists and their impositions or views on the music. Or that everything is sourced or recorded. I am beginning to see tunes come into the revivalist scene that I learned straight from living trad. fiddlers. Old Hang On (Phoebe Ice), Squirrel Hunters, Hell on the Potomac... Not everyone can have that experience, but it ain't dead.


 


 

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Dave S

United States
689 posts since 10/18/09

05/15/2017 23:21:03 View Dave S's Photo Albums Reply with Quote

>Chubby Wise is almost never mentioned in conjunction with The Orange Blossom Special, the song that he wrote with Ervin T. Rouse.

I found this account pretty convincing, but who knows....

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farmerjones

United States
1210 posts since 10/22/07

05/16/2017 11:59:03 View farmerjones's Photo Albums Reply with Quote

If i were going to investigate the origins of individual fidde tunes, the first thing i'd get was copy of The Fiddler's Fakebook, and a copy of Ryan's Mammoth collection. This way i would not be reinventing the wheel, in as much as those two collections contain.

As far as copyrights and copyrighting of traditional music, look no farther than the Harry Fox Corporation, and their search engine.  It is somewhat aggravating to see how most of it is copyrighted.  Only a foolish lawyer would proceed against somebody that knows a traditional tune is just that.

I am not a historian. I know how a tune can get diluted and convoluted by the time it gets across a campground, let alone longer times and distances. I've never been a purist. The notion of a purist (concerning fiddle tunes) is really quite funny. Getting two people to agree on chronological and/or regional divisions is akin to herding cats.

If someone aspires to be a fiddle player, one must be careful of the rabbit holes.  Because it takes thousands of hours to become competent. Hours spent down a rabbit hole are not spent in the woodshed. I better leave it at that.

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dsreiner

United States
971 posts since 6/26/07

05/16/2017 12:50:23View dsreiner's MP3 Archive View dsreiner's Classified Ads View dsreiner's Photo Albums Reply with Quote

Friends,

To trace tunes and look for sources, try this amazing site from Andrew Kuntz:

The Fiddler's Companion  including an alphabetical index here and including ABC versions of tunes
 

It's gradually being converted into this improved site:

Traditional Tune Archive 

Dave
 

Below is a sample entry from The Fiddler's Companion, for the tune Blackberry Blossom.  Traditional Tune Archive is better organized for Blackberry Blossom, but doesn't have all the tunes yet.

BLACKBERRY BLOSSOM/BLOSSUM [1] (Blat Na Smeur). AKA and see “Maud(e) Millar [2],” "The Strawberry Beds,” “Strawberry Blossom [3]." Irish (originally), Canadian, American; Reel. USA, southwestern Pa. Canada, Prince Edward Island. G Major (Harding, Kennedy, Kerr, O’Neill, Perlman, Sullivan): E Flat Major (Stanford/Petrie). Standard tuning. AB (Miller, Perlman, Stanford/Petrie, Sullivan): AAB (Hardings, Kennedy, Kerr, O’Neill). "The Magic Slipper" is a very similar tune. Familiar to Irish tradition, from at least the year 1850, if not earlier, according to Bayard (1981). The title appears in a list of tunes in his repertoire brought by Philip Goodman, the last professional and traditional piper in Farney, Louth, to the Feis Ceoil in Belfast in 1898 (Breathnach, 1997). It was recorded in the 78 RPM era in New York by Sligo fiddler James Morrison. Sources for notated versions: Planxty [Sullivan]; Shape (Greene County, Pa.; elderly when collected in 1930's) [Bayard]; Sterling Baker (b. Mid-1940's, Montague, North-East Kings County, Prince Edward Island) [Perlman]; Kerry fiddler Paddy Cronin [Miller]. Allan's Irish Fiddler, No. 71, pg. 18. Bayard (Dance to the Fiddle), 1981; No. 97, pg. 57. Cole (1000 Fiddle Tunes), 1940; pg. 8. Cotter (Traditional Irish Tin Whistle Tutor), 1989; pg. 76. Giblin (Collection of Traditional Irish Dance Music), 1928; 14. Harding’s Original Collection; No. 75. Kennedy (Traditional Dance Music of Britain and Ireland: Rants & Reels), 1997; No. 6, pg. 4. Kerr (Merry Melodies), vol. 1; pg. 34 (appears as "The Strawberry Beds"). Miller (Fiddler’s Throne), 2004; No. 124, pg. 83. O'Neill (Krassen), 1976; pg. 113. O'Neill (Music of Ireland: 1850 Melodies), 1903/1979; No. 1295, pg. 243. O'Neill (Dance Music of Ireland: 1001 Gems), 1907/1986; No. 560, pg. 104. Perlman (The Fiddle Music of Prince Edward Island), 1996; pg. 62. Ryan’s Mammoth Collection, 1883 pg. 31. Stanford/Petrie (Complete Collection), 1905; No. 475, pg. 120. Sullivan (Session Tunes), vol. 3; No. 52, pg. 21. Ainar ANR-001, Todd Denman – “Like Magic” (1995. Appears as “Maude Millar’s”). BM-91, Buddy MacMaster – “Glencoe Hall.” Edison 51041 (78 RPM), accordion player John H. Kimmel (appears as one of the tunes in the "Stack of Barley Medley"). Gael‑Linn 069, Kevin Burke ‑ "An Fhidil Straith II." Green Linnet CD 1069, Michael Cooney – “Happy to Meet, Sorry to Part” (1986). Shanachie 79006, Mary Bergin ‑ "Traditional Irish Music." Shanachie 33004, "The Pure Genius of James Morrison." Shanachie 79010, Planxty – “The Well Below the Valley.” Smithsonian Folkways SFW CD 40481, Brian Conway – “First Through the Gate” (2002. Learned from New York fiddler Andy McGann). Tara CD 3001, Planxty – “After the Break.” Seamus Tansey – “Jigs, Reels and Airs.” P.J. & Marcus Hernon – “Beal A' Mhurlaigh” In Safe Hands. Conal Ó Gráda – “The Top of Croom.” O'Aces – “From Night Til Morning.” Ben Lennon and Friends – “The Natural Bridge.” John O'Halloran – “But Why, Johnny?” Ceoltoiri Coleman – “The Killaville Sessions.” Mary Mac Namara – “The Blackberry Blossom.” Kevin Crawford – “The ‘D’ flute album.”

See also listings at:

Alan Snyder’s Cape Breton Fiddle Recording Index

Jane Keefer’s Folk Music Index: An Index to Recorded Sources 

Alan Ng’s Irishtune.info

X:1

T:Blackberry Blossom, The [1]

R:reel

D:Mary Bergin: Feadoga Stain.

D:Planxty: The Well Below the Valley

Z:id:hn-reel-117

Z:transcribed by henrik.norbeck@mailbox.swipnet.se

M:C|

K:G

ge|:dBAd BG~G2|dBBA B2ge|dBAd BG~G2|1 eaag abge:|2 eaag agef||

~g3f gaba|~g3b agef|~g3f gbag|ea~a2 agef|

~g3f gaba|~g3b a2ga|agaf gfed|eaag abge||

X:2

T:Blackberry Blossom, The [1]

M:2/4

L:1/8

R:Reel

S:Stanford/Petrie (1905), No. 475

Z:AK/Fiddler’s Companion

K:E_

e/>c | B/G/F/A/ G/E/E/F/ | G/E/E/F/ G/B/e/c/ | B/G/F/A? G/E/E/G/ |

F/f/f/g/ fe/c/ | B/>G/F/A/ G/E/E/F/ | G/A/G/F/ G/B/e/c/ | B/G/F/A/ G/E/E/F/ |

G/c/c/=B/ c || c/d/ | e/d/e/f/ g/a/g/f/ | e/d/e/f/ g/c/c/d/ | e/d/e/f/ e/f/g/e/ |

c/f/f/g/ f c/d/ | e/d/e/f/ e/f/g/f/ | e/d/e/f/ g/c/c/a/ | g/e/f/d/ e/d/c/B/ | G/c/c/=B/ c ||


Edited by - dsreiner on 05/16/2017 12:51:27

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DavidM

Australia
82 posts since 5/21/16

05/16/2017 14:49:21 Reply with Quote

Yes, that Fiddler's Companion is a Hell of a resource. I found the perspectives in this thread interesting, I will not add any, but I love the way the McGarrigle sisters wove the titles of several tunes into their song Going Back To Harlan.

"Bounce the Bow, Rock the Gallows for the Hangman's Reel,

And wake the Devil from his Dream."


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5vK7jitvJXI

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ChickenMan

United States
3065 posts since 9/26/08

05/17/2017 05:46:54View ChickenMan's MP3 Archive View ChickenMan's Photo Albums View ChickenMan's Blog Reply with Quote

Neither of those Blackberry Blossoms look like the Arthur Smith version that most Americans play (both OT and BG). It may look like the Irish tune of the same name, but I'm not familiar enough with that one to know. Considering the sources cited, I'd say it's the Irish version which had never sounded like Smith's version.
Tune names that sound cool can get used by someone who can't recall the tune but liked and remembered the name.

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dsreiner

United States
971 posts since 6/26/07

05/17/2017 08:28:07View dsreiner's MP3 Archive View dsreiner's Classified Ads View dsreiner's Photo Albums Reply with Quote

quote:
Originally posted by ChickenMan

Neither of those Blackberry Blossoms look like the Arthur Smith version that most Americans play (both OT and BG). It may look like the Irish tune of the same name, but I'm not familiar enough with that one to know. Considering the sources cited, I'd say it's the Irish version which had never sounded like Smith's version.
Tune names that sound cool can get used by someone who can't recall the tune but liked and remembered the name.

ChickenMan, you're right.  There are multiple versions of Blackberry Blossom, including Garfield's BB, and the one I showed and linked to isn't the usual BB. 

Here is the more standard version at the Traditional Tune Archive.

Dave

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DavidM

Australia
82 posts since 5/21/16

05/17/2017 15:40:49 Reply with Quote

I don't know who is credited on the original 78 record, but County LP re-release of Arthur Smith's credits him for Red Apple Rag. I would have thought the folks at County Records were conscientious about such things.

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