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 holding small parts for planing

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modon

United States
Joined 2/16/2012
429 Posts

06/19/2012 10:04:14  View modon's MP3 Archive  Reply with Quote

I just read an excellent post put up by giannaviolins about fiddle set up.

http://www.darntonviolins.com/violinmagazine/book/setup.pdf 

 It raises a couple questions for me and hopefully the more experienced luthiers can offer their opinion. First... what kind of vise or dog set up do you use when planing the very small fiddle parts? I know ebony doesnt cut freely even with a very sharp plane and the blank must be held secure somehow. Second question... is any advantage lost by doing major shaping by sanding or grinding instead of cutting? I realise that for very delicate work a super sharp knife will do a superior job of shaping and will leave a smooth, finished surface... but when you're 'hogging away' the extra wood in initial shaping, is there any tonal reason not to do so?

My trade (horologist) is loaded with techniques that are more based on tradition than anything else. The idea being that a skilled craftsman will do things the hard way simply because HE CAN! And I find that admirable for sure... but not being a proffesional luthier myself, I wonder if anything is lost by grinding instead of cutting.

kubasa

United States
Joined 9/25/2007
300 Posts

06/19/2012 10:20:47  View kubasa's Photo Albums  View kubasa's Blog  Reply with Quote

For little ebony parts like the nut and the saddle, I usually just hold the parts in my fingers while wearing gloves.  I haven't come up with any other good method.  The gloves are important though.  As for the fingerboards, I use a jig like this to hold the fingerboard for planing and prepping the top of it.

Completed Fingerboard

For planing the underside of the fingerboard, I just flip my plane upside down in my vise and push the fingerboard over the plane rather than the plane over the fingerboard (again, wearing gloves).  It works for me.  As for major roughing out, I don't know what to say.  I've heard of people using all kinds of power tools to do the job.  Personally, I stick with my hand tools because I'm more afraid of what I might do with a powertool! 

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modon

United States
Joined 2/16/2012
429 Posts

06/19/2012 12:10:32  View modon's MP3 Archive  Reply with Quote

What I've been doing is to hold little parts in a 'flanging tool'. A vise grip with wide 'lips' normally used to bend sheet metal. Then I apply it to a belt sander (gasp!) till the piece is roughly the right size and shape, finishing up with files and sandpaper and/or a sharp knife.
I need to invest in some smaller planes tho. The smallest one I have is a block plane.

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KCFiddles

United States
Joined 7/1/2007
4635 Posts

06/19/2012 14:24:11  View KCFiddles's MP3 Archive  View KCFiddles's Photo Albums  View KCFiddles's Blog  Reply with Quote

Ebony cuts really easily if your tools are sharp. Sharp means sharp enough you don't even notice when they cut you.  One test is that they should shave hairs off your arm with no pressure at all, and the hairs should just sort of pop off when they are cut. Plane blade should be equally sharp, set fine, with a fine mouth if possible. I have a couple of Stanley adjustable mouth block planes for bridges and general work, and a couple of old ratty 103s for fingerboards, one of them with a high bevel angle for gnarly ebony fingerboards.

I've got a false edge of pine screwed to my bench, and there are a number of notches and grooves cut into it for holding things, and a number of little backing blocks glued to it to hold things against while I am working on them, but sharp tools are the key.

I find I just  can't do clean, accurate work by sanding or grinding, not that my work is all that great anyway.  It would be worse if I didn't use knife and plane. Can't imagine trying to do good work with a machine, and I spent a good part of my life making my living with power tools. In this case, hand tools are clearly faster and easier.

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giannaviolins

United States
Joined 6/24/2007
3024 Posts

06/19/2012 16:11:26  View giannaviolins's Classified Ads  View giannaviolins's Photo Albums  Send giannaviolins a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote

Custom bench stop - as Woodwiz describes above - and moving the part against the plane, with the plane in a bench vise.  Or glue the oversize piece on and then shape.

Ebony works easily, but does indeed require sharp tools, understanding of grain effects, and excellent technique.

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FiddleDoug

United States
Joined 1/25/2008
591 Posts

06/20/2012 03:51:21  View FiddleDoug's Photo Albums  Reply with Quote

If you're using your good planes, knives, or chisels, you don't want to use anything with metal jaws, or protruding screws. One slip, and you'll have to spend a lot of time re-sharpening the tool.

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Dave Richard

Joined 8/14/2009
24 Posts

06/21/2012 03:53:51  View Dave Richard's Photo Albums  Reply with Quote

The book on violin restoration by Weisshar pictures (at least)two very nifty jigs: one for holding a bridge while hand planing to final thickness, the other a simple jig for holding flat thin pieces or stock for hand planing. I know the book is expensive- try to get it through your library.


Edited by - Dave Richard on 06/21/2012 03:55:28

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