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 ARCHIVED TOPIC: Coda Bow Diamond NX


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Learner - Posted - 01/10/2011:  09:02:11


I'm thinking of replacing my current carbon fiber bow with a Coda Diamond NX. It seems to be retailing for around $350 right now.

I've read some posts from members who had tried or purchased this bow. I'd be interested in hearing some updates from those who have had them now for a while, or from others who have recently evaluated them.

- How do they compare to your other bows, wood or otherwise?
- How do they compare to other carbon bows that you've used?

Also it would be good to hear from members who have had a chance to do a fair comparison between the Coda Diamond NX, SX, and GX models. Maybe also the Coda Prodigy model. By "fair" comparison I mean having had a chance to try them for more than a brief moment, and even possibly with the same rosin on each bow.

Thank you in advance!

Frank

RobBob - Posted - 01/10/2011:  10:42:02


I have a very early Coda bow, s/n v200. A student just got a GX and I have to say, it is a dandy. Can't really beat a Coda bow for all round use in different locations, weather, temperatures, etc.

giannaviolins - Posted - 01/10/2011:  11:20:07


The Coda line steadily gets better as the price goes up. This is absolutely consist. I've sold a lot of Coda bows, too. Now whether a fiddler needs or will notice the improvements is another matter. The improvements show up in classical techniques.

The Joule is different. More weight towards the tip. Some fiddlers really like that.

They generally handle better than equivalently priced wood bows. Not as warm a tone, not as much personality. Great value, regardless.

docmarc - Posted - 01/10/2011:  11:32:34


...I've been using the NX for about a month after a couple of years of the Prodigy version... I find the Diamond much smoother, better balanced and less prone to oddball squeeks that I occasionally got with the Prodigy... I traded a pernambuco covered carbon fiber bow back to my violin shop for the NX...for me, the difference is noticable...

cheekee - Posted - 01/10/2011:  11:54:01


i have the prodigy. the store let me take home the prodigy and 3 other bows (one of which was the diamond). i was able to determine that i couldn't feel any difference between the prodigy and the diamond...probably because i'm just not skilled enough yet. so, i decided to save myself some money and go with the prodigy. a year later, i tried the diamond...and i still don't feel like it makes much of a difference for me.

mswlogo - Posted - 01/10/2011:  12:04:25


I think the SX and GX is the same bow except for cosmetics.

I had all planned to get an SX until I tried one and didn't care for it all.

The main reason was with my bow hold, the corner of my thumb rests right between the frog and the leather pad, right in that nook.

If it's to narrow it feels all wrong. This can even vary on the same bow because it depends on the hairing and that gap changes as you adjust the frog tension.

Most other bows felt fine, I tried a dozen in the $500 - $1200.00 range and wanted the Coda very much based on comments. But all the coda bows had that nook very narrow and I just could not get past it.

Make sure you buy from a place that will do a trial or go somewhere that you can try lots of bows.

giannaviolins - Posted - 01/10/2011:  12:53:26


You're clearly wrong. Call Jeff at Coda, get a briefing. The GX and SX are distinctly different, all the ones I've had here, which is quite a number. In a completely consistent manner. The GX is faster handling and pulls a slightly more crisp tone that is at the same time slightly warmer. Not a huge difference, but obvious and absolutely consistent.

Some people will like this type of bow. Some won't. Some features can be changed, such as the leather and hair. Some can't. I can't think of any product that's for everyone.

Please do make really sure you're correct before disparaging a product, which is what you've done above. Essentially indicating that Coda is cheating their customers by putting the GX stamp on some bows and charging more. That's not the right thing to do. If you have such a concern I strongly - and I mean very strongly - suggest you contact the manufacturer and have your concerns addressed prior to disparaging the product in public. Some manufacturers get upset over disparagement and take legal action, as they're entitled to do. That generally proves highly unpleasant for the defendant.

Learner - Posted - 01/10/2011:  13:28:53


quote:
Originally posted by mswlogo

.......I had all planned to get an SX until I tried one and didn't care for it all.

The main reason was with my bow hold, the corner of my thumb rests right between the frog and the leather pad, right in that nook.

If it's to narrow it feels all wrong. This can even vary on the same bow because it depends on the hairing and that gap changes as you adjust the frog tension...........
That's interesting. I have the opposite problem right now with my two bows: too much space between the leather and the frog, because of the hair stretching from humidity, especially when I keep them in the basement which is damper than the upstairs.

The opposite situation would be a problem: not being able to rehair the bow to get the frog close enough to the leather. I saw that a couple of times: bow hair completely relaxed, but couldn't get the frog close enough to the leather. In one case, the problem was because it was a cheap bow and the leather grip had moved. On the other, it was a poorly made bow where either the leather was glued on in the wrong place, or not a long enough slot was cut in the stick for the frog.

If there's not enough gap, the bow could be rehaired to allow for more of a gap. And the hair will probably just naturally stretch over time. So the problem that you describe does not seem to be an issue in my mind.

Frank


Edited by - Learner on 01/11/2011 07:01:08

mswlogo - Posted - 01/10/2011:  13:32:30


quote:
Originally posted by voodoo

You're clearly wrong. Call Jeff at Coda, get a briefing. The GX and SX are distinctly different, all the ones I've had here, which is quite a number. In a completely consistent manner. The GX is faster handling and pulls a slightly more crisp tone that is at the same time slightly warmer. Not a huge difference, but obvious and absolutely consistent.

Some people will like this type of bow. Some won't. Some features can be changed, such as the leather and hair. Some can't. I can't think of any product that's for everyone.

Please do make really sure you're correct before disparaging a product, which is what you've done above. Essentially indicating that Coda is cheating their customers by putting the GX stamp on some bows and charging more. That's not the right thing to do. If you have such a concern I strongly - and I mean very strongly - suggest you contact the manufacturer and have your concerns addressed prior to disparaging the product in public. Some manufacturers get upset over disparagement and take legal action, as they're entitled to do. That generally proves highly unpleasant for the defendant.



Take a valium. I said *I THINK* they are the same.

And I based that on reading this forum and others. I didn't say they just put a stamp on it (you said that). The frog is different; they use gold inlay on the top model etc. My understanding was it was the same bow and hair on the top two models. All the other stuff may be different.

You mean they are gonna sue me because I gave an honest opinion. I think you gave another good reason to avoid them. Thanks for the warning.

I gave a good explaination of why they didn't work me.

If I don't like your work and say so, you gonna sue me. Thanks for the warning.


Edited by - mswlogo on 01/10/2011 14:55:03

emilysweet - Posted - 01/10/2011:  13:38:19


How about trying a Fiddler's Bow instead? You can get one for the same price.
Listed here fiddlehangout.com/classified/2462

mandopickr - Posted - 01/10/2011:  14:00:21


I tried the NX and GX on Black Friday (along with several other bows). As it turned out, I got a permabuco bow, but considered going back and getting the NX as well.

Though the GX handled better, the sound for the NX was too close to justify the difference in price. Both were nice bows though. Most likely my skill level isn't to the point where I can appreciate the GX.

Susan H - Posted - 01/10/2011:  14:15:46


I have an NX and I love it. Very smooth, clear sound. I think you can try before you buy from Fisher Violins and Shar Music.

Learner - Posted - 01/10/2011:  15:16:47


quote:
Originally posted by Susan H

I have an NX and I love it. Very smooth, clear sound. I think you can try before you buy from Fisher Violins and Shar Music.

Excellent!

Thank you very much, Susan, and everyone else that has replied about their experiences with the NX and other CodaBow lines. It is very much appreciated.

I saw the post from last year when you got your NX, Susan, and was expecially glad to see your update here.

My situation is not such that I could try one via mail order. But that is what I would do if I was buying one outright.

As it stands, the reason that I'm thinking of getting rid of my current graphite is that I've noticed a slight "sideways" curve to the stick, especially when the hair is under tension. It might have been this way from the beginning, and I just didn't notice. I didn't think that carbon fiber could "warp" over time (especially if not subjected to temperature extremes), but maybe it is more pronounced that when I bought it? That seems unlikely, but maybe not impossible.

It's a shame, really, because the current bow is pretty nice looking. Good, clean craftsmanship, with a silver "fleur de lis" insert on the frog, instead of the usual "eye". Some sort of mother-of-pearl or faux-pearl inserts on the end of the screw button, and also on each facet of the three part button. It is marked "Richter CG 600". And it also actually plays pretty well. But the sideways curve is probably not helping my bow tracking.

Anyway, I emailed the luthier from whom I bought it about the curve problem. He said that he was leaving for a trade show this week, and that he could order me a CodaBow while on his trip. It seems as though he will credit me for the original price that I paid for my current carbon fiber bow. So if this goes as planned, I'll end up buying from him to get that credit. That is the reason that I value everyone's input so much, as I won't have much of a chance to do comparison shopping.

Thanks again,

Frank


Edited by - Learner on 01/11/2011 07:03:43

Andah1andah2 - Posted - 01/11/2011:  11:16:50


I got one a month ago and am very happy with it. I also based my decision on feedback here because my experience is very limited. My last bow bow was a good one and my reason for upgrading was having an itch to do so, and knowing from everyone else that I would have an excellent bow to grow into. I feel more confident with it and that makes it feel better to me. I don't notice a difference in sound form my old bow, but my wife tells me you can hear the difference from away. She was able to tell me which bow i was playing every time we tried.
I also spoke with Jeff at Coda with some questions I had. He was very helpful and spoke with me for a long time. One point of quality that I noticed right off is how well made the screw mechanism is. You can just tell from how smoothly and consistently the screw turns from loose to tight and reverse.

Learner - Posted - 01/11/2011:  12:57:21


quote:
Originally posted by Andah1andah2

I got one a month ago and am very happy with it. I also based my decision on feedback here because my experience is very limited. My last bow bow was a good one and my reason for upgrading was having an itch to do so, and knowing from everyone else that I would have an excellent bow to grow into. I feel more confident with it and that makes it feel better to me. I don't notice a difference in sound form my old bow, but my wife tells me you can hear the difference from away. She was able to tell me which bow i was playing every time we tried.
I also spoke with Jeff at Coda with some questions I had. He was very helpful and spoke with me for a long time. One point of quality that I noticed right off is how well made the screw mechanism is. You can just tell from how smoothly and consistently the screw turns from loose to tight and reverse.

Thanks, Stew. Great feedback. Interesting how the bow can make such a difference in sound, from a distance. I've heard this a lot about fiddles themselves, how the sound "under the ear" can be vastly different than from a distance.

Frank

Learner - Posted - 01/11/2011:  13:01:28


quote:
Originally posted by RobBob

I have a very early Coda bow, s/n v200. A student just got a GX and I have to say, it is a dandy. Can't really beat a Coda bow for all round use in different locations, weather, temperatures, etc.

Thanks, Rob.

I think that I also like the fact that it is American designed and manufactured. Not that I have anything against foreign made instruments and bows. But it is nice to find a quality, affordable product that is made in the U.S.

Frank

mswlogo - Posted - 01/11/2011:  15:39:36


quote:
Originally posted by Learner

quote:
Originally posted by RobBob

I have a very early Coda bow, s/n v200. A student just got a GX and I have to say, it is a dandy. Can't really beat a Coda bow for all round use in different locations, weather, temperatures, etc.

Thanks, Rob.

I think that I also like the fact that it is American designed and manufactured. Not that I have anything against foreign made instruments and bows. But it is nice to find a quality, affordable product that is made in the U.S.

Frank



It sounds to me that if your Luthier is good enough to give you full credit, he'll take care of you in case you didn't like it.

Learner - Posted - 01/21/2011:  12:31:04


quote:
Originally posted by mswlogo

It sounds to me that if your Luthier is good enough to give you full credit, he'll take care of you in case you didn't like it.


MSW:

One thing that I hadn't figured into the equation is that they will rehair my previous CF bow before putting it back up for sale at the shop. I hadn't counted on that, so I lost $45 off the credit that they gave me for trading in the previous bow.

But that sounds reasonable to me. I wouldn't want to buy a bow with old hair. And some of the strands had broken up at the tip, but had not yet come loose from the bundle completely. We saw that when the luthier removed the frog to look at the tip plug.

I'll report back after I've had a chance to play the NX. I have to say that the appearance is stunning. The brown is actually quite a bit deeper than the online photos show. As a result, the black from the CF cloth is better hidden, while still leaving enough of a visible diamond pattern to be attractive. Quite elegant.

Also, as &a1&a2 mentioned, the screw mechanism is very well made. Very smooth.

The overall appearance quality is near to perfect.

An interesting note is that the bows are serialized. You pull the frog off to find the serial number on the bow handle under the frog.

Frank


Edited by - Learner on 01/21/2011 12:32:40

Learner - Posted - 01/21/2011:  14:13:10


Here's a useful link that I found on Coda's website. It compares the responses for the different models of the Diamond series:

codabow.com/performance/performance.html



Here are the features of the Diamond models:

codabow.com/features/violin_nx_inlay.html[/url

codabow.com/features/violin_sx_inlay.html

codabow.com/features/features_...nlay.html



And here are links to model comparisons: first the NX to the SX; and then the NX to the GX:

codabow.com/features/features_...x_sx.html

codabow.com/features/features_...x_gx.html



Some of the links weren't well defined on their site, so I thought that it would be helpful to post them here.

Frank


Edited by - Learner on 01/21/2011 18:38:23

giannaviolins - Posted - 01/21/2011:  18:43:33


I'd have put the GX distinctly above the SX for agility - one the things I notice right away.

fiddler59 - Posted - 01/24/2011:  10:08:39


The GX is most definitely different from the SX.......like Voodoo said, the GX is more agile and pulls a crisper tone that also has more depth. I have played several of each (GX & SX) and the difference was there every time.


David Blackmon

Learner - Posted - 01/24/2011:  10:46:15


quote:
Originally posted by fiddler59

The GX is most definitely different from the SX.......like Voodoo said, the GX is more agile and pulls a crisper tone that also has more depth. I have played several of each (GX & SX) and the difference was there every time.


David Blackmon

Thanks for the feedback, Steve and David. It's much appreciated.

Someday I hope to get a backup fiddle. If and when I do, I may look into a GX for a new bow to go along with the new instrument (assuming that I find out that I like the NX long term).

Best wishes,

Frank

BetteB - Posted - 02/02/2011:  20:07:22


quote:
Originally posted by voodoo

The Coda line steadily gets better as the price goes up. This is absolutely consist. I've sold a lot of Coda bows, too. Now whether a fiddler needs or will notice the improvements is another matter. The improvements show up in classical techniques.

The Joule is different. More weight towards the tip. Some fiddlers really like that.

They generally handle better than equivalently priced wood bows. Not as warm a tone, not as much personality. Great value, regardless.



I recently tried some CodaBows and thought they were great. Then picked up one, for the same price range, that outplayed them all. One of those things - just worked for me and my fiddle. turned out to be a pernambucco from Brazil. It brings out the sound and tone of my fiddle like nothing I've every played.

Purchase of a bow is an individual thing, but I have heard lots of great things about the CodaBow and people who have them like them very much. I just happened to find something better.

giannaviolins - Posted - 02/03/2011:  04:56:58


I suspect "better" depends so much on what one is doing with the bow and the particular instrument and player.

The Brazilian bows are an excellent choice in general. I'm very happy with them and have sold many.

Learner - Posted - 02/27/2011:  04:27:22


UPDATE:

I said that I would report back after I had my new Diamond NX for a while. So here it is:

I have been using it as my primary bow for the past month. It feels somewhat different than my pernambuco bow, but not in any negative way. It has good control, and I've been able to draw a rich sound from my violin with it.

As was mentioned by others, the frog has a steep lip in the front, such that it almost feels as though it should be rounded over more. But after using if for a while, I've grown to not even notice it.

The finger leather has a good heft and thickness to it. The silver nickel winding still looks very elegant after a month of playing.

I did find a cosmetic defect after a day or two: the white plate on the tip of the stick had some brown epoxy paint on part of the edge, making the edge of the plate where it joins the tip to look "wavey". Or maybe it was the adhesive used to attach the plate? At any rate I was able to remove the most obvious part of it by using the the end of a sharp blade to scrape the side of the plate. Other than that, the quality of parts and assembly is quite good.

If you buy one of these, you will need the serial number to register it. The serial number is under the frog. Unscrew the screw all of the way to remove the frog.

My only real complaint is that the finish is very "slick". So it can be a little harder to hold securely if your hands are sweaty than a wood bow would be. At first I had a hard time keeping the tip of my pinkie from sliding around on the stick. But I eventually got used to it.

Suffice it to say, it is a much better bow than I am a fiddler or violinist at this point. Overall, I consider it be a a good value for the money.

Frank


Edited by - Learner on 02/27/2011 04:29:59

fiddleblissed - Posted - 02/28/2011:  23:12:06


I was completely happy with my bow until reading this thread. Now I am lusting after a new one. In my jam group, instrument acquisition fever rotates among us. In a week or two, I predict it will be my turn to buy a new toy ;) I'd better start shopping, eh?

M-D - Posted - 03/01/2011:  00:02:48


I'll be posting a Diamond GX for sale, in the next day, or so.

Susan H - Posted - 03/01/2011:  04:40:09


Frank, here is another update on my NX. I recently had it rehaired and it is so much smoother. I don't use as much rosin as before and it just seems to just glide across the strings. I asked what kind of hair was used; Argentinian horse hair. Very nice. And I use Kaplan dark rosin.



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